Ot III and beyond sources plagiarized from

[Gib]

I dunno, I know many thought it was a hill too far, and the way they solved it at Flag on the 6 course? Ringers. Wed evening they'd show up, and you'd have 4 or 5 in a row getting dated and passing the students off. Bam, bam, bam. I was coaching Rosser Cole back on the BC at ASHO in the 80's and we had to practically chain him to the chair he was sooooo very frustrated - he would go down a false chain, the reads would die off, go back, find where he went wrong and go forward - he finally got the date. You'd think he'd be happy? Nah. He was pissed we put him through so much hell. But he did it. It really shows off your expertise. It was a date in the millions all the way down to the seconds.

Mimsey

so much for the science of certainty, taking a year to do the dating drills, LOL. I'd bet a week later, Rosser couldn't duplicate the dating drill on a Wog, that would be another year of Hell. LOL

I do understand Bill. It's pretty convincing the pinch test, but yet that is based on Hubbard saying charge is connected to the mental image picture containing the pain of the pinch. But yet, on the other hand, there is no charge connected in the dating drill, so Hubbard's theory makes no sense.

I've been many a times being the coach on that stupid dating drill, after a few hours, those are the times one wished they were in the Wild Wild West and just pulled out a six shooter and said I'm outta here and leaving on the same horse I rode in on, you guys are full of shit.

 

[DagwoodGum]

so much for the science of certainty, taking a year to do the dating drills, LOL. I'd bet a week later, Rosser couldn't duplicate the dating drill on a Wog, that would be another year of Hell. LOL

I do understand Bill. It's pretty convincing the pinch test, but yet that is based on Hubbard saying charge is connected to the mental image picture containing the pain of the pinch. But yet, on the other hand, there is no charge connected in the dating drill, so Hubbard's theory makes no sense.

I've been many a times being the coach on that stupid dating drill, after a few hours, those are the times one wished they were in the Wild Wild West and just pulled out a six shooter and said I'm outta here and leaving on the same horse I rode in on, you guys are full of shit.

That's why I always say that the actual "doingness" of $cientology is so excruciatingly boring that it's only upon "completion" that one experiences a feeling of relief and renewed freedom of no longer having to do the F**KIN level, chain, rundown, course or whatever Ron put in your path to trudge through.
So it's the NOT DOING of it anymore because one is "complete" that provides the feeling of somehow having gained something.
Only, on the OT levels one's feeling of being complete on BT's gets entirely overwhelmed by the grotesque overrun of it all that one finally caves..
And oh the cost of it all...

 

[Gib]

That's why I always say that the actual "doingness" of $cientology is so excruciatingly boring that it's only upon "completion" that one experiences a feeling of relief and renewed freedom of no longer having to do the F**KIN level, chain, rundown, course or whatever Ron put in your path to trudge through.
So it's the NOT DOING of it anymore because one is "complete" that provides the feeling of somehow having gained something.
Only, on the OT levels one's feeling of being complete on BT's gets entirely overwhelmed by the grotesque overrun of it all that one finally caves..
And oh the cost of it all...

You got no disagreement from me, I realized the same thing. What comes to mind is "The way out is through".

Put Hubbard in front of me right now, and the six shooter gets drawn. LOL As well as for that Little Dickie character COB.

 

[Leland]

I dunno, I know many thought it was a hill too far, and the way they solved it at Flag on the 6 course? Ringers. Wed evening they'd show up, and you'd have 4 or 5 in a row getting dated and passing the students off. Bam, bam, bam. I was coaching Rosser Cole back on the BC at ASHO in the 80's and we had to practically chain him to the chair he was sooooo very frustrated - he would go down a false chain, the reads would die off, go back, find where he went wrong and go forward - he finally got the date. You'd think he'd be happy? Nah. He was pissed we put him through so much hell. But he did it. It really shows off your expertise. It was a date in the millions all the way down to the seconds.

Mimsey

They used me for the same at CC and ASHO......I always read beautifully on the meter....and usually had a wide floating needle.....

CC used me to train one of their Auditors....(Video pass?)

And I was always asked to "hold the cans" on the date and locate drills on the BC....along with other drills.....

I guess....I was a ringer...but never realized it...LoL

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

You got no disagreement from me, I realized the same thing. What comes to mind is "The way out is through".

Put Hubbard in front of me right now, and the six shooter gets drawn. LOL As well as for that Little Dickie character COB.

I think you'd have to look a bit like the below if you plan to shoot hubbard - he be dead. Yeah - go back to the fifties and save us all from the grief. Mimsey

 

[Leland]

I was thinking about this thread this afternoon.....and thought I'd post something for never ins....and anyone else reading this thread.

Earlier we were talking about the "Bridge" and passing from the Physical to Spiritual "plain"

Hubbard talked about how so many ( all those before him) seeking a spiritual path...failed and fell into the Abyss...and so many "bones" of the dead there.....

But that HE....had discovered the "Wall of Fire" and OT III and this was the ONLY way to get across this chasm safely.

That the Cult of Hubbard was the ONLY way.....Bla Bla Bla....

And that the route was all taped....Bla Bla Bla....

This was talked about continually......and re-enforced continually...

Cult of Hubbard members eventually allowed blinders to be put on them....and narrowed their "objectives" to accomplish in life....to only going up the "bridge"

BUT then after OT 3 being out for years...is not decades....then NOTs came out.....and then later New OT 7 came out....

All these actually address the same area...of "body thetans"

Even if one came in with 200 thousand dollars.....and got up to the point of doing these levels....one could easily spend 10 years doing them.....

And that is not including what has to be done...just to get to the point of doing OT 3 thru OT 7

 

[Maria Cuervo]

I was thinking about this thread this afternoon.....and thought I'd post something for never ins....and anyone else reading this thread.

Earlier we were talking about the "Bridge" and passing from the Physical to Spiritual "plain"

Hubbard talked about how so many ( all those before him) seeking a spiritual path...failed and fell into the Abyss...and so many "bones" of the dead there.....

But that HE....had discovered the "Wall of Fire" and OT III and this was the ONLY way to get across this chasm safely.

That the Cult of Hubbard was the ONLY way.....Bla Bla Bla....

And that the route was all taped....Bla Bla Bla....

This was talked about continually......and re-enforced continually...

Cult of Hubbard members eventually allowed blinders to be put on them....and narrowed their "objectives" to accomplish in life....to only going up the "bridge"

BUT then after OT 3 being out for years...is not decades....then NOTs came out.....and then later New OT 7 came out....

All these actually address the same area...of "body thetans"

Even if one came in with 200 thousand dollars.....and got up to the point of doing these levels....one could easily spend 10 years doing them.....

And that is not including what has to be done...just to get to the point of doing OT 3 thru OT 7

Gee if one felt inhabited by some being, a body thetan or some other, a priest from any number of spiritual persuasions would remove it for free. In a day or two. According to the spiritual lore demons are much meaner than BTs. Why endure for decades and go broke that way when it is pretty clear OT levels don't work.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Well, people are posting here and reading this, but I have no idea what this thread has turned into...

The dilemma -write a post that stays pure and unread or one that gets eyeballs and comments but takes on a life of its own ...

Oh well, the blog life beats the cult life .No RPF here - yet !!

I tried to get it back on track. I think you'll just have to accept that we are all a bunch of distracted Q and A artists.

Mimsey

 

[Gib]

Gee if one felt inhabited by some being, a body thetan or some other, a priest from any number of spiritual persuasions would remove it for free. In a day or two. According to the spiritual lore demons are much meaner than BTs. Why endure for decades and go broke that way when it is pretty clear OT levels don't work.

as you say, which totally aligns with the OP source of OT3,

there's no money in that, nor power nor control (affirmations). I think I need to make a Bridge, the final statement in Dianetics, the Modern Science of Mental Health.

Here's a mean demon:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8QjrBjdb2T8

Gotta love the sublime of it all, folkore made real, just like Hubbard, the Sci Fi writer that he was. LOL

"In short, the Beautiful, according to Burke, is what is well-formed and aesthetically pleasing, whereas the Sublime is what has the power to compel and destroy us."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Phil...gin_of_Our_Ideas_of_the_Sublime_and_Beautiful

 

[DagwoodGum]

Gee if one felt inhabited by some being, a body thetan or some other, a priest from any number of spiritual persuasions would remove it for free. In a day or two. According to the spiritual lore demons are much meaner than BTs. Why endure for decades and go broke that way when it is pretty clear OT levels don't work.

I was naturally inclined to squirreling so I addressed them as a group running them through the incidents with group processing moving them out in batches along with all the psychic "karate chops" to their grasps back when I still believed to enough of an extent, nearly 40 years now.
It had by then also occurred to me that maybe ones "BT Load or Lava Java Load" was primarily an issue of karma and if that were to be addressed one would be noticeably less afflicted by them.

 

[Dulloldfart]

My big question, re the below quotes - perhaps Paul or Terril or someone has been in the LRH library at saint Hill and would know if there's a lot of books on the occult there?

I don't recall any in the AOSHUK one in Qual, but I couldn't guarantee it. It wasn't a big library at all. If there was a private LRH library in the Manor full of leather-bound Krafft-Ebings and the like I never saw it.

Paul

 

[Dulloldfart]

That was my guess, too.

Some years ago DullOldFart did an experimental video with two buckets of water in which he submerged one hand and one can in each bucket so that the water completed the circuit. The result was fairly similar to directly holding the cans IIRC, so it's probably not measuring sweat.

I put a few such videos in the esmbdof channel at YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/user/esmbdof/videos.

Points of interest, with hands separated from the cans by a few inches of water:

1. The meter reads similarly to when holding the cans normally in air, except about 1/10th the sensitivity (i.e. it needs to be jacked up 10x to see the reads)

2. It can't be reading on sweat or muscle twitches.

The experiments were very sloppy, but the results are so marked that I don't see properly conducted tests being much different.

Here's one two-minute vid, with no cans this time. At the time (2009) I was having a discussion on ESMB with meter-sceptical Anon Orange:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=now694JmYnE

Paul

 

[Terril park]

I don't recall any in the AOSHUK one in Qual, but I couldn't guarantee it. It wasn't a big library at all. If there was a private LRH library in the Manor full of leather-bound Krafft-Ebings and the like I never saw it.

Paul

IIRC Ken Urquhart commented on the LRH Library. I think
it was on the Apollo.

 

[ThetanExterior]

I've seen the LRH library in Saint Hill Manor but the only book I remember was a biography on Cecil Rhodes.

If only I had perfect recall .........

 

[DagwoodGum]

You got no disagreement from me, I realized the same thing. What comes to mind is "The way out is through".

Put Hubbard in front of me right now, and the six shooter gets drawn. LOL As well as for that Little Dickie character COB.

"The way out is the way through" Ah yes!!! They're saying the way out is the way in and the schleps changed the road sign...

 

[Hypatia]

"The way out is the way through" Ah yes!!! They're saying the way out is the way in and the schleps changed the road sign...

That's because people can never get through. Not only do they keep changing the route but they put all this sticky crap on it so that cult members tread a path much like a no-pest strip.

As an added bonus, the bank is still there and they don't end up being able to operate independently of body and "as is" stuff at will.

So just in case you think you made it through, you find out that it's all still there with you.

Yay!

 

[Maria Cuervo]

That's because people can never get through. Not only do they keep changing the route but they put all this sticky crap on it so that cult members tread a path much like a no-pest strip.

As an added bonus, the bank is still there and they don't end up being able to operate independently of body and "as is" stuff at will.

So just in case you think you made it through, you find out that it's all still there with you.

Yay!

Then only to find it was all made up. The 'as-ising', the 'bank'. But not the pest strip.

 

[Hypatia]

Then only to find it was all made up. The 'as-ising', the 'bank'. But not the pest strip.

Just thought of something.

I think the difference between Scientology's as-isng and other modalities' enlightenment is that with them, you aren't trying to erase anything. You just strive to be able to not be attached to it. We become attached to pain and resentment just as we do to our possessions and other things we don't want to lose. Isn't that funny? We hold on to stuff we don't even like as if it was a beautiful painting or new house or never ending supply of chocolate cake.

Maybe I'm too simple minded for Hub's ideas, but I always thought as-ising was a bit contradictory. You erase the bad incident. No, wait, it's just the charge. You won't have amnesia. You'll still know what happened. Am I stupid for thinking this is a bit convoluted?

In any event, if a person could decide he didn't give a rat's ass about the painful things that happened and that they'd hold no sway over him, that would wrap it all up for him right there. That isn't as-ising, either.

 

[Maria Cuervo]

Just thought of something.

I think the difference between Scientology's as-isng and other modalities' enlightenment is that with them, you aren't trying to erase anything. You just strive to be able to not be attached to it. We become attached to pain and resentment just as we do to our possessions and other things we don't want to lose. Isn't that funny? We hold on to stuff we don't even like as if it was a beautiful painting or new house or never ending supply of chocolate cake.

Maybe I'm too simple minded for Hub's ideas, but I always thought as-ising was a bit contradictory. You erase the bad incident. No, wait, it's just the charge. You won't have amnesia. You'll still know what happened. Am I stupid for thinking this is a bit convoluted?

In any event, if a person could decide he didn't give a rat's ass about the painful things that happened and that they'd hold no sway over him, that would wrap it all up for him right there. That isn't as-ising, either.

I think you are exactly right....There is no as-ising but you can break the attachment and move on. As-ising seems contradictory to me too.
Once something ceases to affect a person, who cares if it 'as-ises'?

Sort of like now experimental scientists in UK I think are all excited they can remove a memory from the brain, of a traumatic incident. Well that seems awful. Like removing a limb. But on the other hand getting over the trauma would be a different thing if it no longer affects the person. They can remember that it DID affect them, which I think the memory removal would do away with. For myself I want to remember whatever has affected me even if it no longer does. As for as-ising...it seems a bit pointless to care if anything as-ises.

 

[Gib]

"The way out is the way through" Ah yes!!! They're saying the way out is the way in and the schleps changed the road sign...

I can't tell you how many times I've had to use that statement, in my mind, to get thru an auditing session, and especially thru the TR's & Objectives Co-Audit I did a few years back. Talk about a thought stopper statement, it was constantly used on the TR's& Objectives Co-Audit ( now called Survival Rundown) to get me to continue, and this fuk nut is basically saying the same thing, only saying "you have to do the process for hours, not just a simple cog". I can't express in words the cringe factor when I heard these vids:

http://tonyortega.org/2015/05/04/mo...scientologys-sad-state-of-affairs/#more-22289

http://tonyortega.org/2015/04/28/se...-cheating-on-the-survival-rundown/#more-22155

http://tonyortega.org/2015/04/26/ex...us-state-of-scientology-right-now/#more-22097