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“Earlier, disconnection as a condition was cancelled."

AnonKat

Crusader
Sling your mud if you have to, but I like to discuss this in the light of these comments.

John Nunez // July 15, 2010 at 7:59 pm | Reply

The following is public record: Robert Vaughn Young was a member of the Church of Scientology for a period of 20 years (1969-1989), he had worked in many areas within the organization including the highest management echelons.

‘IN THE UNITED STATES DISTRICT COURT FOR THE DISTRICT OF COLORADO – Civil Action No. 95-K-2143: Declaration of Robert Vaughn Young in Support of Defendant’s Opposition to the Motion of Bridge Publications, Inc. for Summary Judgment Against all Defendants for Copyright Infringement. Subscribed and sworn to before me this day of February, 1997, Robert Vaughn Young.’

Section 29 of this affidavit reads:

“I have personal knowledge that material was written and issued under the name of L. Ron Hubbard that he did not author. While working at ASI, I personally wrote material to be issued under his name for several years. This ranged from simple messages to be sent to various organizational staff on events such as his birthday or a holiday, to my composing an entire large directive that was issued under his name. In these instances, they were done without his knowledge or consent. The directive that I wrote concerned the Scientology policy of ‘Disconnection’. The order to do this came from David Miscavige. Miscavige said that we had to reinstitute the Policy of Disconnection and that I was to write the policy for this. I wrote it and it went through several revisions. It was not sent to Hubbard for his approval, but was issued into the Church of Scientology. I might note that at the time I was not working for the Church of Scientology, but was working for a for-profit corporation.”


Lady Minn // July 15, 2010 at 9:19 pm | Reply

Dear John,

Thank you for bringing this up. That reference was one of the things that I used to handle my son. I told him about it over the phone and he found it on the internet. It seemed to make a great difference to him.

I think it would be a good idea for any Scientologist from whom others have disconnected, to make copies of this and send it to the person doing the disconnection. It certainly will get them to think, and usually leads to them looking into other data. This is what happened to me many years ago when I started researching the subject of disconnection on the internet. The same thing happened with my son. Also, the actual policy letter in which LRH cancels disconnection is a good one to show such persons. It is in the earlier editions of the OEC Volumes. What is very interesting is that this is referred to in the NEW “Introduction To Scientology Ethics” issued by the Church as a Basics book. It is on page 207 under the heading of “HISTORY’:

“Earlier, disconnection as a condition was cancelled. It had been abused by a few individuals who’d failed to handle situations which could have been handled and who lazily or irresponsibly disconnected, thereby creating situations even worse than the original because it was the wrong action.” — LRH

Yes, this is in the latest Ethics Basics Book issued by the Church! If this isn’t proof that LRH cancelled disconnection, then I don’t know what would be! In an earlier post, I commented that DM must have forgotten to edit that one out! You can show that to any current member of the Church to support the fact that LRH did cancel disconnection. It lends credibility to Robert Vaughn Young’s affidavit that cancellation as a condition was re-instated without LRH’s knowledge.

Just food for thought from a mad Mom,
Lady Minn
 
IMO people need to know exactly how disconection works if they are going into battle with the COS , beause the cult will bring up the "Disconnection Cancelled" policy.

While the submissions were being heard for the inquiry in OZ, Virginia Stewart claimed she has never ever heard of disconnection in the COS -only from the media.

I think she went too far there, because AFAIK the Disconnection Cancelled Policy is part of many staff courses, especially HCO hats but maybe even on Staff Status 2 etc....(I had to study it when I was in).
The thing is....the Diconnection Cancelled Policy has to be studied precisely because everyone in the org has to know the *shore story* so as to prevent staff members openly refering to diconnection as a policy. So Virginia Stewart went too far, she *should* have just said that Disconnection had been cancelled and *could* have submitted the policy.

None of this is meant to say that disconnection *really* is/was cancelled of course - just that it was a *shore story*

It is possible that the Disconnection Cancelled policy did not apply to all countries. I think it came out originally after an Inquiry in NZ, or OZ.
 
Saying Disconnection is canceled and actually doing it are two entirely different things, Hubbard practiced Disconnection on his own children right up until his death. Scientology can not co-exist with non-Scientologists who are not willing to participate in the role playing con game. The Suppressive Person Policy is there for a reason, it is to shelter cult members from the truth.
 

programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
I don't remember any Disconnection policies being canceled.
However, I do remember a "Fair Game" policy supposedly being canceled.
 

TG1

Angelic Poster
Back in the day disconnection was nothing like it is now. Others may have had different experiences back in the day, but "disconnection" wasn't anything I witnessed seeing problems about. (I had other issues, but not this one.)

I never disconnected from anybody in my life when I was in -- 1972 through 1988 or so. I always knew I had the right to do so, but only remember being coached in ethics to resolve conflicts through two-way communication or (if things were just unnegotiable) through "good roads and fair weather" communication. The emphasis back in the day was to make the church look good. Not stupid like all this disconnection stuff does now.

I do remember seeing goldenrod on people occasionally, but if I knew specific people who'd been declared, I also thought they were assholes -- not in how they thought about the Church, but in how they treated other people. Seemed to me like they actually were assholes.

It's a whole other kind of joint down there now. I honestly don't even recognize it. It's a whole other kind of thing.

What goes on now is just freakin insane! In fact, it's so insane it's like the CoS is just painting a big old target on its chest and back and yelling: "Here, we are. Come get us. We want to be wiped out!" This disconnection shit doesn't even make any sense from any perspective I can imagine the CoS might hold.

TG1
 

FoTi

Crusader
I don't remember any Disconnection policies being canceled.
However, I do remember a "Fair Game" policy supposedly being canceled.

I remember sometime around 1977 that the GO announced to the org that anyone who was disconnected should reconnect and handle their scene with whomever they were disconnected from because the disconnection policy was causing bad PR. So, everyone was required to reconnect, but I never saw any policy on it or anything in writing. Then sometime later, I don't know when, the disconnection policy went back into play again.
 

FoTi

Crusader
Saying Disconnection is canceled and actually doing it are two entirely different things, Hubbard practiced Disconnection on his own children right up until his death. Scientology can not co-exist with non-Scientologists who are not willing to participate in the role playing con game. The Suppressive Person Policy is there for a reason, it is to shelter cult members from the truth.

If Hubbard didn't want to talk to his kids, that's his business, but it's not okay for the CoS to force what LRH wanted to do with his life, and his family, on anyone else.
 
If Hubbard didn't want to talk to his kids, that's his business, but it's not okay for the CoS to force what LRH wanted to do with his life, and his family, on anyone else.

I completely agree, but the point I'm making is Hubbard knew first hand the con game can not work if people who refuse to play the game are allowed to be around the ones who are playing. His disconnection policy was based on his own first hand experience. It is a very important component of the con game, Scientology will never work in an open society. If it did work in an Open Society, do you think Terril would waste half his life posting those silly Tech outside COS: Success stories propaganda pieces? He wouldn't have to advertise it, people would be knocking down the doors if it really delivered.
 

AnonKat

Crusader
Why would anyone "sling mud" on this?

Because In essence what I ask is to differentiate between Hubbard and Miscavige.

If there is none so be it but if in this case Miscavige reinstated a cancelled or "cancelled" disconnection policy I like to know.

There are going to be scientologists so I like to know precisely what is what. I don't mind there being scientologists if they strip the shit back to before KSW doctrine.

Hubbard throws science overboard tottaly especcially in 1958 when he called Darwinian theory an Implant in a lecture

If scientologists want to believe that so be it. Better call themselves Implantologists
 
Because In essence what I ask is to differentiate between Hubbard and Miscavige.

If there is none so be it but if in this case Miscavige reinstated a cancelled or "cancelled" disconnection policy I like to know.

There are going to be scientologists so I like to know precisely what is what. I don't mind there being scientologists if they strip the shit back to before KSW doctrine.

Hubbard throws science overboard tottaly especcially in 1958 when he called Darwinian theory an Implant in a lecture

If scientologists want to believe that so be it. Better call themselves Implantologists


Are you working on the idea that if disconnection was cancelled as a policy by Hubbard, then instances of disconnection happening now are to be blamed on Miscavige?

There are the orders and advices that were not made public but were to be followed by the GO / OSA. There could be a lot more in there (written by Hubbard) than in the one or two? green on white policies. Orders which *could* contradict the policy.
 

AnonyMary

Formerly Fooled - Finally Free
There would need to be an actual policy letter that discontinued it, before it would need to be re-instituted. Is there a policy letter that discontinued it?

You're thinking along the same lines as I am. To start with, what is the original reference Vaughn is referring to? And then where is the cancellation reference and refers back to reinstituting the original?
 

Kutta

Silver Meritorious Patron
From TGI:
Back in the day disconnection was nothing like it is now.

I also was never told to disconnect with anyone. However, after I left the SO in 1981, (routed out per policy, never declared, no ethics condition imposed, no Feeloader bill, nothing suggested about how to get back 'in')nobody from scientology contacted me or had any communication with me until the Basics push, 25+ years later. Then, it was apparently ok per policy for everyone and his dog to phone me everyday at any time for more than a year to not only buy the Basics but to try and get me back on lines. Also to visit at my home all friendly and not a hint that I was bad, bad, bad for leaving the SO and the whole shebang for that length of time.

What changed? In some respects it seems DM intensified disconnection, in other situations, reconnection seems to have been pushed. It is all a bit weird, like disconnection could be waived for the possibility of increased income.
 

auntpat

Patron with Honors
Disconect 1960s

My husband and I were working in a franchise in Omaha. My brother had bought some books seen an intro or something. He apparently stated his opinion of Scn to the franchise holder. Next thing I know we were told to disconect from him. come on now.:confused2:

I disregarded the order, and my husband would drive me out to my brothers house for a visit and sit in the car. He was always following orders ! At least he did not write a KR on me.

Pat
 

Alanzo

Bardo Tulpa
Jim Logan tried this one about 6 months ago on the Scientology Forum.

He wrote a big fatwa on it.

The thing is that L Ron Hubbard wrote an HCOPL in the mid-1960's (1964) called the Suppressive Acts PL which made it a suppressive act to remain connected to a person who was declared suppressive by HCO.

That PL was never canceled anywhere, by anyone. It is still in force to this day - never having not been in force since the first day L Ron Hubbard wrote it himself and issued it.

Therefore, it has always been a high crime to remain connected to someone HCO has deemed an SP.

Therefore, no one has ever canceled disconnection since it was first created by L Ron Hubbard in 1964.

In response to inquiries being held in New Zealand and Ireland in 1968, Hubbard wrote a letter to these inquiries telling them that disconnection was canceled, but he never amended the HCOPL on suppressive acts regarding disconnection from SPs. He just wrote a letter as a PR action to these two government inquiries looking into the abuses of scientology at the time, and lying to them about it.

LRH was lying when he said he canceled disconnection, as he lied about so much else.

Until the Suppressive Acts HCOPL is canceled, enforced disconnection in Scientology will never be canceled.

Don't let anyone ever lie to you about this ever again.

Here's Hubbard's letter to the commision in New Zealand:

Because of the hierarchical structure of Scientology and the extent to which policies and directions were issued from above, it seemed to the commission that, if practices which had been regarded as objectionable could be cancelled by fiat, they could also by the same fiat be reintroduced. This problem was put to Lady Hort, who undertook to communicate with L. Ron Hubbard and obtain some assurance as to the future course of Scientology in this respect.
At the adjourned hearing in Wellington, Lady Hort produced a letter which she said was signed by L. Ron Hubbard. This letter was as follows:
L. RON HUBBARD
Saint Hill Manor,
East Grinstead,
Sussex.
26th March, 1969.

The Commission of Enquiry into
Scientology in New Zealand. Gentlemen,
With regard to the practice of disconnection, I have taken this up with the Board of Directors of the Church of Scientology, and they have no intention of re-introducing this policy, which was cancelled on the 15th November, 1968.
For my part, I can see no reason why this policy should ever be reintroduced, as an extensive survey in the English speaking countries found that this practice was not acceptable.
(Signed) L. Ron Hubbard
L. Ron Hubbard
LRH/rw​



Here's the link to the whole thing:


http://www.cs.cmu.edu/~dst/Cowen/audit/nz01.html

 

Illegal Alien

Patron with Honors
If Hubbard didn't want to talk to his kids, that's his business, but it's not okay for the CoS to force what LRH wanted to do with his life, and his family, on anyone else.

ABSOLUTELY RIGHT

In my time in Scio is has always been enforced ALWAYS.

"Miscavige said that we had to reinstitute the Policy of Disconnection and that I was to write the policy for this."

This means LRH wrote it in the first place he thought it up and he himself enforced it.

To possibly try put it out there that disconnection is not LRH is the biggest load of sh.t I have read.
 

programmer_guy

True Ex-Scientologist
Disconnection was related to SP declares.
SP declares were never canceled as a policy.
On another related note, "fair game" was never canceled either... for declared SPs.
 
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