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Discussion in 'Scientology-related Videos' started by AnonKat, Apr 25, 2011.

  1. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    How does one choose a substitute goal to immortality if that is the schtick. Tough not to feel one is settling.
  2. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    Why do you think all the real estate investment is going on in the Church. Seems idiotic. Anyone know the rationale?
  3. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    "Living is a pretty grim joke, but a joke just the same.

    "The entire function of man is to survive. Not for 'what' but just to survive...

    "I turned the thing up [The Dynamic principle of Existence: Survive!] so it's up to me to survive in a big way.

    "Personal immortality is only to be gained through the printed word, barred note or painted canvas or hard granite.

    "Foolishly perhaps, but determined nonetheless, I have high hopes of smashing my name into history so violently that it will take a legendary form even if all the books are destroyed.

    "That goal is the real goal as far as I am concerned.

    "Things which stand too consistently in my way make me nervous. It's a pretty big job. In a hundred years Roosevelt will have been forgotten - which gives some idea of the magnitude of my attempt."

    L. Ron Hubbard, from his 'Excalibur letter' of August 1938
  4. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    I guess many others have been down that road.

  5. EP - Ethics Particle

    EP - Ethics Particle Gold Meritorious Patron

    It is not "The Road less Travelled By".

    But I am hopeful that the road travelled by my friends here "...has made all the difference".


    "To-morrow, and to-morrow, and to-morrow,
    Creeps in this petty pace from day to day,
    To the last syllable of recorded time;
    And all our yesterdays have lighted fools
    The way to dusty death.
    Out, out, brief candle!
    Life's but a walking shadow, a poor player,
    That struts and frets his hour upon the stage,
    And then is heard no more. It is a tale
    Told by an idiot, full of sound and fury,
    Signifying nothing."

    Or perhaps more hopefully and sustaining:

    "...As the long train
    Of ages glide away, the sons of men,
    The youth in life's green spring, and he who goes
    In the full strength of years, matron and maid,
    The speechless babe, and the gray-headed man—
    Shall one by one be gathered to thy side
    By those, who in their turn shall follow them.

    So live, that when thy summons comes to join
    The innumerable caravan which moves
    To that mysterious realm, where each shall take
    His chamber in the silent halls of death,
    Thou go not, like the quarry-slave at night,
    Scourged to his dungeon,
    but, sustained and soothed
    By an unfaltering trust, ..."

    Excerpt from "Thanatopsis" by William Cullen Bryant

    The crew assembled and remembered here on ESMB were not "poor players" by any stretch of imagination - but rather bold and hopeful least that's the way I see it.

    My hope...well, maybe wish is a better word... is that all "quarry slaves" everywhere be freed from whatever bonds restrain them.

  6. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    I still feel as innocent as before. For that some people regard me as stupid.

    I don't understand why?

  7. uniquemand

    uniquemand Unbeliever

    I have some ideas, Vin. One is that they have accepted an "enemy line" that they are evil persons, or were evil persons for helping what they now view as a cult. It's tricky. If you judge yourself, now, based on what you did then, with less knowledge and different skills, it's often easy to condemn yourself or view yourself with contempt.
  8. uniquemand

    uniquemand Unbeliever

    How does one substitute a realistic goal for one that has been discovered to be a fantasy?

    Those aren't your words, but I think they can help clarify the issue.
  9. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    Maybe these people are hung up on "being" and "surviving". And they expect others to be hung up on "being" and "surviving" too.

  10. Auditor's Toad

    Auditor's Toad Clear as Mud

    Isn't it better to be hung than hung up on?

    And I don't 'expect' to be hung up on.
  11. AnonKat

    AnonKat Crusader

    Well I tought since you great things happeneed to you as a PC and you don't want to throw the Baby away with the bath wather and you are not a Scientologist anymore I direct you to a very Relavant piece about Behavioral Re-Enactment wich has simularities with Hubbards Dramatization Right down to the Trauma stores as Images (engramms) Stimuli (restimulation of an Engramm) and Victim and Abuser roles (Winnin and losing Valence)

    Glad you moved away from it and reclaimed your freedom
  12. Mark A. Baker

    Mark A. Baker Sponsor


    All the difference in the world, although some may be unable to perceive it.

    Mark A. Baker
  13. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    It was wonderful to watch this video finally, and meet the people I knew on Apollo, namely, Alan Buchanan, Maude Castillo, Dede Reisdorf, Frankie Freedman, Ken Urquardt, and, of course, David and Julie Mayo. I believe, that this wonderful atmosphere existed at AAC, Santa Barbara not so much because of Scientology technology, but due to the common purpose of helping and being helped that was shared, and having a lot of fun while doing this.

    I know that David is now disenchanted with lot of that technology, but I do not think he is disenchated with that purpose that was shared and applied during that period. The big brother seemed to have won in 1984 and that is all right. He can have all the Scientology technology; but he cannot have that spirit and shared purpose.

    Today, it is very possible to have that AAC of Santa Barbara once again without the copyrighted Scientology technology. That same spirit and purpose is still around aplenty and it can be garnered. Much better and more powerful technology than Scientology has already appeared on the scene today.

    Nobody can monopolize research and progress. Scientology is not the only game in town any more.

    Last edited: Apr 28, 2011
  14. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    The way OT abilities are set up in Scientology, have long been tried and abandoned in India. They were called "Siddhis". They simply boosted the ego and were found to be a barrier to real spiritual progress. These OT levels never attracted me.

    OTness, the way it has been promoted in Scientology, is nothing more than these "Siddhis" (Google it, or check in Wikipedia). I think it is time to look at what spiritual progress truly is.

    OT levels seem to provide only Siddhis. They do not provide real spiritual progress.

  15. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    Beautiful EP
  16. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    Substituting a realistic goal for one that has been discovered to be a fantasy is sometimes very hard.

    Adopting a substitute goal for one that was real and bright and breathed life into you, but simply became unattainable....very very hard.
  17. Jachs

    Jachs Gold Meritorious Patron

    I see
  18. CarmeloOrchards

    CarmeloOrchards Crusader

    I watched the video just now.

    I haven't had very much interest in this area.

    I had walked quietly away from the Co$ in 1976. When the AAC was in Palo Alto, i think I walked through the doors once.

    Watching the video, I am solidly with HH and Veda.

    By the time the Mayos exited the S word, I had concluded LRH was the problem. I didn't buy into the OT levels. I figured anyone, who had been so close to LRH was tainted by lack of <whatever it took to walk away>. I just could not imagine staying with all the abuses so obvious. This video enhanced my understanding of who you all were. You still had the rose colored glasses that I couldn't seem to ever wear. You were gung ho. I was a dilettante. It was a club I just couldn't join.

    But seeing John Bell as a mere boy. I didn't know Davina worked there. I saw her only a few weeks ago at a friend's 80th birthday party. Mary Maren just glows. She did in the 60s, also in the 70s, and she still does. Frankie is so lucky! Mary Werneke certainly got around. She was an Vlll in the Co$, and she was in Dallas with Alan later on. She was a good lady.
  19. FoTi

    FoTi Crusader

    Yep...very, very hard.
  20. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    I see spiritual progress as "Simplification of what one perceives through the reduction of complexity and confusion." This is what science has been doing.

    It is this "definition" of spiritual progress that attracted me toward Dianetics and Scientology because, to some degree, it seemed to align all the ideas from my Hindu background. But then something seemed to go very wrong when one started to live it.

    My current approach to spiritual progress is very simple. Look at where the attention goes, read up on that area if possible, and let the mind un-stack itself.