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Ascension Experience

Because in an AE you can get so huge that the physical universe is now within you! :)

I'm thinking about that.
I have----- Ok so some people sometimes get so huge that the universe is in inside them.

Nxt thought = I didn't look.

But no, no, it just don't seem right........
to put it there.............I'm kind of looking now. Yes it is there. But that's because you put it there.

You put your physical universe in,
you take your physical universe out,
you put your physical universe in,
and you shake it all about........

just an idea,
but I'm happy:)
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
I had an idea once.

I examined it minutely and for a very long time.

This idea had been "with me" for my whole life and seemed to underlie almost everything I was Being, Doing and Having.

The idea I had was this;
Ever since I first encountered and entered into this Universe, all I had been trying to do was get out of it, ie: GTFOH.

Of course I had played many an enjoyable game and experienced many an interesting sensation etc but it seemed to me that my prime effort was always somehow directed at undoing that "original going in".
In short, I wanted out of the Physical Universe.

I won't go into the whole story but the long-and-short of it is this:

I inspected this idea completely, realised that I'd arrived at the solution which was, to actually handle the Universe rather than continue trying to disconnect from it, I ceased resisting it and.... phhhht, I was OUT!

Completely OUT.

No matter, no energy, no space, no time!

All of the above could be created but it was all within me instead of the reverse.

I rested, I ceased all action, I ceased thinking, I ceased perceiving, I "felt" something which I later realised was the feeling of true peace, accepting all.

After enjoying this peaceful respite for some "moments", I then made a decision. Knowing all that I now knew about the Physical Universe, I decided to re-enter it.

This time the decision was KNOWING, I had some inkling of its true nature and knowingly decided to continue playing the game.

The story of my "coming back" has amused many that were witness to it or have heard about it. That's for another time.

The thing is; my perception of this Universe has never been the same and, of course, I have never been the same since. This is how I became myself. :)

That is wonderful!

:)
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
...

Quote snipped from Alan's post.
"They are Ascension Experiences. All are phenomena that occur outside of the physical universes time and space, when the spirit awakens and becomes more enlightened."

Alan, the idea that these things happen outside of the physical universe - which seems to be a common idea - always bugs me. I don't think I was outside the physical universe. I don't think people can go in and out of the physical universe.

I think its a case of people experincing in a different way and that includes their usual organization of knowlege about their experince, their perceptions,
suddenly collapsing. When they reorganise their knowledge about their experince, using words, ideas, concepts, the idea that they were "outside" the physical universe is convenient. No matter how timeless I felt, (and I have had other similar experiences), and no matter how cosmic and vast I felt I don't feel I was "outside" - perhaps expanded.

I think the reason I need to say this is that I sometimes feel I am in a room full of people. We are all looking at something. They are all calling it one thing and I am the only one who thinks it is not quite that but something else.

To me, it seems that there is a viewpoint, which may be called "physical universe viewpoint." One may pop out of this viewpoint but still be able to perceive the physical universe. This would be an AE phenomenon.

This "physical universe viewpoint" may be related to first chakra (animalistic mind and survival). This popping out may relate to popping out of one's addiction to the physical universe.

Similarly, certain viewpoints may correspond to other chakras. Popping out of those viewpoints may lead to a series of higher and higher AEs.

My belief is that after experiencing an AE, one is never the same again... One never returns to the previous state.

I believe that one returns to the realm of the next chakra; or, one is now in a "higher viewpoint" related to a "higher addiction" that one needs to pop out from.

The ancient knowledge of chakras does seem to point into a direction that I don't claim to understand. But it could point to a series of "addictive viewpoints" that one needs to pop out from.

.
 

Alan

Gold Meritorious Patron
The Chakras are a scale.

Starting from the base Chakra you ascend higher and higher.

Should you be in a higher state and someone or something directs your attention and positions you in a first chakra (animalistic mind and survival) you will actually find your life getting worse.

Most people have experienced AEs - so it is fairly easy to begin processing and training them at a much higher positive level.

Alan
 

Vinaire

Sponsor
When I look at this whole Scientology operation, I perceive a hidden chuckle somewhere.

The apparent purpose seems to be to make mindless zealots trying to aim toward some star high goal.

But the underlying purpose seems to be to test what one is made of really, and to sort those out who can really think for themselves.

And ESMB has become a gathering place of those who passed that test.

The physical universe, with its myriads of aspects, is just a higher test.

:eyeroll:
 

uniquemand

Unbeliever
That's one way of looking at it. I think you have to be ridiculously charitable to hold that view, though. I don't think Hubbard was trying to sort out those that could think for themselves (except to get rid of them), I think he was trying to exploit those that stayed. Many of those that stayed were quite capable of thinking for themselves, they were just betrayed into giving service to a being who wasn't deserving of it, and a corporate entity designed to hold them.
 

Pierrot

Patron with Honors
The Chakras are a scale.

Starting from the base Chakra you ascend higher and higher.

Should you be in a higher state and someone or something directs your attention and positions you in a first chakra (animalistic mind and survival) you will actually find your life getting worse.

Most people have experienced AEs - so it is fairly easy to begin processing and training them at a much higher positive level.

Alan

The Chakras are the "Know to Mysery" Scale. Ooops... - Know to Mystery scale.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
When I look at this whole Scientology operation, I perceive a hidden chuckle somewhere.

The apparent purpose seems to be to make mindless zealots trying to aim toward some star high goal.

But the underlying purpose seems to be to test what one is made of really, and to sort those out who can really think for themselves.

And ESMB has become a gathering place of those who passed that test.

The physical universe, with its myriads of aspects, is just a higher test.

:eyeroll:
Yes, Vin, a chuckle indeed.

I have an analogy that I often use to illustrate what I really think of scientology’s “Bridge to Total Freedom”.

It may just as readily apply to Life itself.

Imagine an Obstacle Course, you know, the sort of thing used in Military training programs (Assault Training Course) or one of those vacuous Reality-TV shows.

This Obstacle Course has walls to climb, rope-nets to scale, barbed wire to crawl under, swamps to wade, ravines to traverse, mountains to be conquered etc. etc.

The thing about this Obstacle Course is that it has (apparently) severe penalties for failure; broken bones, cuts and bruises, drowning, falling to one’s death and, most importantly, the assignment of failure/lose should you fail to complete it.

Usually, when you complete this particular Obstacle Course you find yourself right back at the Start Line.

You’re right back where you started; bruised, battered, exhausted but exhilarated nonetheless simply because you did it, you passed the test!

That’s the main difference, you now know you can do it.

To me, that’s how it is with the Bridge and that’s how it is with Life.

In my opinion, the real casualties of the scn experience are those still caught in the doingness or failure of the Obstacle Course. They’re still trying to scale that wall, they’re sitting mid-course crying frustrated tears and “It can’t be done”, they’re lost in the stagnant swamp and floundering for direction, they're searching out short-cuts, they’re afraid to cross the ravine for fear of falling (you can step off the Bridge at any moment and you won’t fall at all) or, worst of all, they’re continually re-doing the whole thing because they didn’t achieve anything notable from their earlier efforts.

The scientology Obstacle Course is a construct. It is an invented test and, to me, simply mimics life.

If you have ever completed an Obstacle Course you’ll know exactly what I mean.

It’s just an analogy and probably has flaws but it has served me well in helping others understand something of the nature of the “Bridge To Total Freedom”.
 
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Yes, Vin, a chickle indeed.

I have an analogy that I often use to illustrate what I really think of scientology’s “Bridge to Total Freedom”.

It may just as readily apply to Life itself.

Imagine an Obstacle Course, you know, the sort of thing used in Military training programs (Assault Training Course) or one of those vacuous Reality-TV shows.

This Obstacle Course has walls to climb, rope-nets to scale, barbed wire to crawl under, swamps to wade, ravines to traverse, mountains to be conquered etc. etc.

The thing about this Obstacle Course is that it has (apparently) severe penalties for failure; broken bones, cuts and bruises, drowning, falling to one’s death and, most importantly, the assignment of failure/lose should you fail to complete it.

Usually, when you complete this particular Obstacle Course you find yourself right back at the Start Line.

You’re right back where you started; bruised, battered, exhausted but exhilarated nonetheless simply because you did it, you passed the test!

That’s the main difference, you now know you can do it.

To me, that’s how it is with the Bridge and that’s how it is with Life.

In my opinion, the real casualties of the scn experience are those still caught in the doingness or failure of the Obstacle Course. They’re still trying to scale that wall, they’re sitting mid-course crying frustrated tears and “It can’t be done”, they’re lost in the stagnant swamp and floundering for direction, they're searching out short-cuts, they’re afraid to cross the ravine for fear of falling (you can step off the Bridge at any moment and you won’t fall at all) or, worst of all, they’re continually re-doing the whole thing because they didn’t achieve anything notable from their earlier efforts.

The scientology Obstacle Course is a construct. It is an invented test and, to me, simply mimics life.

If you have ever completed an Obstacle Course you’ll know exactly what I mean.

It’s just an analogy and probably has flaws but it has served me well in helping others understand something of the nature of the “Bridge To Total Freedom”.



I have been thinking about the "bridge" paralleling life too, recently.
The "bridge" and all the organizations etc it generates really are like ronny's little reality show. Magoo sees it more as the Truman Show than a reality show and she may be more accurate there.

On the point about how we come back to the beginning of "the obstacle course of life" bruised and battered but "exhilerated" , well some don't. We have had the opportunities and wherewhithal to develop perspectives, stategies and ideas to get some satisfaction out of the obstacle course. We are lucky. We can philosophise and spirtualise and really have nice feelings sometimes. There are lots who can't do that. I have met quite a few of them. They get minimal or no chances to feel exhilerated and the older they get the less chances they get.
We can see it all as a joke. Good for us, and I'm not saying we shouldn't, but I wonder sometimes if I should just add the qualification "For me......." to the beginning or end of statements about LIFE, when I am feeling spiritually cosy, because others are not as lucky to be able to have that.
I hope I don't sound preachy. This is just something Iv'e been thinking about.
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
<...snip>

On the point about how we come back to the beginning of "the obstacle course of life" bruised and battered but "exhilerated" , well some don't. We have had the opportunities and wherewhithal to develop perspectives, stategies and ideas to get some satisfaction out of the obstacle course. We are lucky. We can philosophise and spirtualise and really have nice feelings sometimes. There are lots who can't do that. I have met quite a few of them. They get minimal or no chances to feel exhilerated and the older they get the less chances they get.
<...snip>
What you are describing is a person that is either still on the Obstacle Course and not yet completed, someone who has bought into the idea that they somehow failed, or someone trapped within the Course as I described, ie:

"In my opinion, the real casualties of the scn experience are those still caught in the doingness or failure of the Obstacle Course. They’re still trying to scale that wall, they’re sitting mid-course crying frustrated tears and “It can’t be done”, they’re lost in the stagnant swamp and floundering for direction, they're searching out short-cuts, they’re afraid to cross the ravine for fear of falling (you can step off the Bridge at any moment and you won’t fall at all) or, worst of all, they’re continually re-doing the whole thing because they didn’t achieve anything notable from their earlier efforts."

The Obstacle Course of Life may have similarities to the Obstacle Course that is "The Bridge", my analogy is about the Bridge but, yes, I did suggest that "it may just as readily apply to Life itself".
 
What you are describing is a person that is either still on the Obstacle Course and not yet completed, someone who has bought into the idea that they somehow failed, or someone trapped within the Course as I described, ie:

"In my opinion, the real casualties of the scn experience are those still caught in the doingness or failure of the Obstacle Course. They’re still trying to scale that wall, they’re sitting mid-course crying frustrated tears and “It can’t be done”, they’re lost in the stagnant swamp and floundering for direction, they're searching out short-cuts, they’re afraid to cross the ravine for fear of falling (you can step off the Bridge at any moment and you won’t fall at all) or, worst of all, they’re continually re-doing the whole thing because they didn’t achieve anything notable from their earlier efforts."

The Obstacle Course of Life may have similarities to the Obstacle Course that is "The Bridge", my analogy is about the Bridge but, yes, I did suggest that "it may just as readily apply to Life itself".


I am not referring to Mr or Ms White Western Educated etc.
Even if someone believes in "past and future lives" some people will have a freakin long, nasty, "obstacle course" to do. Thinking of life as "God's little School House" or in this case "obstacle course" is nice, but perhaps a view we can only afford when things happen to be going well. Not to say that we cannot affect things. Some people get less help with that than we did.
 

spbill

Patron with Honors
[..]I think the reason I need to say this is that I sometimes feel I am in a room full of people. We are all looking at something. They are all calling it one thing and I am the only one who thinks it is not quite that but something else.

You aren't the only one.
Bill
 

Panda Termint

Cabal Of One
I am not referring to Mr or Ms White Western Educated etc.
Even if someone believes in "past and future lives" some people will have a freakin long, nasty, "obstacle course" to do. Thinking of life as "God's little School House" or in this case "obstacle course" is nice, but perhaps a view we can only afford when things happen to be going well. Not to say that we cannot affect things. Some people get less help with that than we did.
DB, My post giving the analogy of the "Bridge" as an Obstacle Course is in response to Vinaire talking about "the whole Scientology operation" (ie: the post I originally quoted).

Your responses quoting me seem to be about a completely different subject.

Are you talking generally about those whom you see as being somehow less fortunate in life?

I'm talking about scientology's Bridge as an Obstacle Course.
 
You aren't the only one.
Bill

Mmmm, I noticed in one or two of your posts you talk about your experiences - what would normally be called "spiritual" experiences, or the kinds of "EPs" that people get from scientology processes, but you do not jump to assume that you know exactly how to characterise them or label them, or assume you completely understand what they mean spiritually vs physically etc. I hope I am not being too vague or misunderstanding you. Anyway I like your apparent willingness to keep asking what is actually happening rather than assuming that "having the win" or the "EP" itself gives you a complete understanding of the nature of what is going on.
Hope I have not added to the feeling of not feeling that you are on the same wavelength as others.:)
 
DB, My post giving the analogy of the "Bridge" as an Obstacle Course is in response to Vinaire talking about "the whole Scientology operation" (ie: the post I originally quoted).

Your responses quoting me seem to be about a completely different subject.

Are you talking generally about those whom you see as being somehow less fortunate in life?

I'm talking about scientology's Bridge as an Obstacle Course.



Yes I am referring to less fortunate people. I can see the main point of your post is the scientology "bridge".

But you did say this:

"it may just as readily apply to life itself"
(near the beginning)

and

"To me, that’s how it is with the Bridge and that’s how it is with Life". (near the end)


But I can see I may have read more into it than what is there. Actually I mentioned that I had been thinking recently that the "bridge" may parallel life - as you also expressed it. I had also thought of it as you put it, a sort of obstacle course with bruises and broken bones, and that life is like that.
 
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