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Congratulations OSA (for now)

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Emma, Jan 15, 2011.

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  1. Gottabrain

    Gottabrain Guest

    Terril, I believe you are correct about that. I've never heard of anyone receiving auditing in the FZ or what they call squirrel groups, either, and it is probably an unwritten rule. After all, part of the reason OSA Ops are sent to muck things up is they are brainwashed to believe they and others would be damaged by such auditing. The other thing is, if they found out they weren't - the C of S would lose their Ops.

    Dex was most likely NOT an OSA Op, but horribly duped by someone close to him. So much so, that even after it was pointed out to him that the PMs etc that he sent were straight from the Religious Freedom Watch and other OSA sites, he still claimed they were true. Very disappointing.
     
  2. Smilla

    Smilla Ordinary Human

    I don't believe for a minute that Dex is any kind of OSA operative, just part of a big and very unfortunate misunderstanding.
     
  3. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Wil do.
     
  4. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Indeed!

    I know he's not.

    Duped?

    Can anyone point me to the OSA DA stuff on Mike Laws? Never read it.
     
  5. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One

    One such site is martyrathbunblog.com PLEASE NOTE: This is an OSA-run DEAD AGENT (ie. OSA lies about people) site and it will log your ip address should you choose to visit it.
     
  6. degraded being

    degraded being Sponsor

    Right!.
     
  7. Atalantan

    Atalantan Patron with Honors

    "you can take the kid out of middle school, but you can't always take the middle school out of the kid"?
     
  8. degraded being

    degraded being Sponsor

    The dust will take a lot longer to settle if you keep pushing this line

    "....before letting four of the people causing the most upset back on the board...."

    You see I just don't agree with that statement. That is quite separate from the backchannel spy vs spy game.

    You statement causes me just as much upset on this board as any of the other drama. I have no problem with it as your opinion, and it might actually be true. But I have not reached the conclusion that it is. People trying to ram it down my throat won't make it any more believeable. Especially in the context of your post and the post you are responding to. You are not only not letting it rest, you have projected this into the entire time of the ban, claiming the moral high ground up to the time the banned ones get back and by extension when (if ) they restart posting.
     
  9. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    It's not an unwritten rule. It wasn't forty years ago, and it's not today. And it's certainly not an unwritten rule that a covert op can't audit others, or C/S others, if those actions are necessary to maintain one's cover and believability.

    Additionally, there are those in the Scn FZ/Ind. Scn who would be inclined to return to the Cof$ if Miscavige were to be booted. What might be their state of mind if contacted by "disaffected" but still "in" $cns, with the idea of preparing the way for the eventual (supposed) re-taking of $cn by the (supposed) good guys? How much information would they share? To what extent would they work in cooperation with these (supposed) disaffected members?

    All sorts of possibilities.

    Nothing is off limits.

    That said, I've no idea what they are now doing, so maybe "Intel tech is out." And it's not something I recommend spending much time pondering as it leads to a general atmosphere of distrust.

    But reading responses such as Terril's, reading such things as Dexter's outrage (in an old post) at the suggestion that pc folder culling could have occurred in his Org, since, it couldn't have occurred as he, "wasn't aware of it," shows how deep the naivete runs.
     
  10. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    It didn't start there at all. Emma discusses the issue about Mike and Karen being attacked here:
    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?p=521111#post521111

    She mentions this email and how Mike and Karen were heavily attacked by some posters. To me, it increased on ESMB after an email, one of several people were getting was posted. Here it is, where the part about Mike Laws and Karen pissed me off because it was obvious lies - intention to influence. http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=21263

    The who sent it and why of this email has been a topic of conversations private and otherwise. Here is the email I read on ESMB.

    20th December 2010, 02:57 AM
    thetanic

    From One Foot Out

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    I have been receiving a few emails about MR and MR anonymously, but most of them seem to be CofS trolling. This one isn't obviously so, and it was requested that I post this. So here it is. I don't agree with the perspective, but the writer could be correct. The part about the long downtrend in the CofS is obvious, though.

    Message follows:

    I've taken all I can take, and I can't take no more. I'm not going to tell you who I am, where I am or what I do, but I'm sitting in a position to see the big picture by connecting together the data passing through. Shit, I am surprised; I haven't seen anyone out there among you, put this together yourselves, so it I'm crossing the River Styx.

    The cartel that is in control of the CofS, regardless of all the lying boasts of growth, has long been aware of its downtrending membership and income. The same public can only be squeezed for finances so much and for so long. The need to keep up the appearance of being true to a "source" that expired in 1986 does place limitations on how many times "new and improved" products and services can be successfully marketed - especially given the dwindling market. Those, who have an accustomed level of cash flow, remain bent on maintaining that level, and will consider and apply any method(s).

    Bear in mind that often, with an organization that controls and takes in enormous amounts of money in ways that, if known, would endanger its continuing, the real power(s) often hide behind a figurehead who enjoys the attention while in reality acting as a lightning rod for their masters, who find it convenient for that figurehead to believe he is powerful and important. These powers can have little or no concern for how employees are treated or compensated by that figurehead, as it is no liability to them as long as the cash flow is maintained.

    Powers so motivated, observing a down trending income, find this unacceptable, and are now amenable to finding or accepting a new manager / lightning rod who they believe will provide the best bang for their buck. They may encourage competition between potential candidates and the incumbent, as they can only benefit from this. The rewards of compensation of money and power make it a highly pressured competition, not unlike politics.

    This downtrend would not be so steep if there was a sufficient stream of new customers, but with the negative word of mouth coming from all of those riding the exodus out of the organization, Scientology has become a very tough sell. This leaves as the greatest potential untapped market former adherents of the CofS who remain believers in the doctrine, but do not trust the current management.

    The ideal choice at this time becomes a figure that former adherents could trust and rally around. Enter Mark ("Marty") Rathbun. If he could garner widespread support among the disaffected, and deliver back to CoS substantial numbers of pre-indoctrinated public, he could ride this wave to the top management position. In a blaze of celebratory promotion, and in the terms CoS members are accustomed to, it is broadly announced that "The suppressive squirrel who has been working all this time to destroy Scientology has at long last been rooted out", a "Suppressive Person Declaration" with particulars several pages long is issued, "Basic Scientology is now being restored across the planet under the caring direction of the new Executive Director International", and "A full amnesty" is declared for all those "good Scientologists driven out by out-tech and injustice".

    All this, of course, hinges on Rathbun's success in garnering observable widespread support among the disaffected. To that end, Mr. Rathbun has assembled an advance team. His people apply Scientology principles to ingratiate themselves to disaffected Scientologists and then, having gained acceptability, use whatever credibility gained to promote acceptance of himself well enough that he can then step into the scene without risking negative public reaction and win people over.

    It appears that he's had some success, mainly with former Sea Org members who served in his era and during their tenure had become accustomed to holding him in high esteem, but that hasn't accumulated anywhere near the substantial numbers needed to triumph over the incumbent "COB", The telling blow would be to win over the popular active "free zone" auditors, which would ultimately entail bringing them "back into the fold" so that they would turn in PC folders to CoS, and/or sign Sea Org contracts themselves, resulting in a significant flow of both paying public and staff, and giving an appearance that "all is now right" in the CoS, with a resultant marked improvement in marketability to potential fresh customers.

    Rathbun has not had notable success in this effort, almost universally being rebuffed in his attempts to make inroads directly with operating "free zone" opinion leaders. It appears that for the most part, they have experience of conflicts with the CoS in which Rathbun was an aggressor toward them, and they are unimpressed with what some regard as Rathbun's "charisma". The result is that he must try to find and win over some other substantive "public", out of desperation, or else fail in his bid to out-maneuver the incumbent "COB". It isn't enough to wage campaigns to discredit and weaken David Miscavige. He, MR, must demonstrate that he brings more income stream to the table.

    The remaining avenues are (a) starting his own service facility and attracting a large volume of new public, and/or (b) recovering the numbers of disaffected former customers accumulated and accessible through the Freezone lists, XSO, Ex-Scientologist Message Board and other internet opinion machines. The latter, unlikely as it is, is less formidable than the former. It is less work, less demanding, and far less time consuming to change opinions here with clever and well placed PR activities, as challenging as that is, than it is to build up a following among those uninitiated to Scientology.

    This has been the focus of MR's recent activities. Working from the playbook he learned so well as a high CoS official, Rathbun evades engagement with unsupportive elements, so as to avoid unflattering, detrimental exposure. His PR training taught him to employ others, i.e., an "advance team", to "handle" opinion leaders to create a more favorable predisposition ahead of his personal appearance in an area. This is the mission assigned to Karen De La Carriere, Mike Laws (surprisingly*) and perhaps others not openly known to be agents or associates of Rathbun. *("Surprisingly", because Laws operates with support from the highest levels behind the CoS, has operated with impunity within the CoS and maintained his connections with CoS execs and public even as he quietly backed and provided for Rathbun's "landing out of the CoS" in Texas from the very beginning, and had always lurked quietly in the background of Rathbun's self-promotional activities from the very beginning. So much for his "Marty befriended me when my dog died" shore story).

    I have put myself as far out on a limb as I feel is warranted here, and I will not apologize for presenting no additional proof, names, evidence or documents. This report has been done, at my risk, as a courtesy to you all. Understand this: whether you support and/or contribute to David Miscavige's Church of Scientology, or to Mark Rathbun and his efforts, in the end you are supporting the same machine, with or without superficial cosmetic change. Those of you who have left behind the oppression of the CoS would be well advised to consider "Fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me".
    __________________

    http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthread.php?t=21263
     
  11. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One

    Mary, I wasn't implying that it started there, I was simply doing exactly what I thought Terril had asked ie. pointing him to an OSA DA site, there are many others and they're all full of different versions the same crap.
     
  12. Emma

    Emma Con te partirĂ² Administrator

    You can't stop "back channeling".

    People talk and become friends off the boards. They talk on the phone and via email and form small groups etc. This is normal.

    Whats also normal is that these groups are often involved in activities to bring the CoS to Justice in different ways. For example, the recent raid on the RPF in ANZO didn't "just happen" It was arranged privately amongst the participants off the board. There are obvious reasons why certain group activities are not discussed publicly until the "deed" is done.

    But like all normal human interaction, sometimes there is disagreement between folks and this spills onto the board as certain people try to get leverage or revenge or vent frustration. Sometimes something is "hinted at" covertly in a post that sparks a reaction in another because the other person know the first person is having a dig etc.

    This is where it gets ugly. Rather than pick up the phone and sort it out, some would rather hold on to the resentment and play games.

    Then to make matters worse - recruiting goes on behind the scenes to "back up" whom ever it is that has the grievance. Then you get a bullygang type of effect. People tell "their side" to a sympathetic friend which angers them and without bothering to find out the "other side" they start having their own "digs" etc.

    Yeah it's dumb - but it happens everywhere.
     
  13. Jump

    Jump Operating teatime

    Dumb

    :yes:
     
  14. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Thanks Panda and Mary. Will read up on all this stuff I missed.
     
  15. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    Hi PT, please take no offence!

    I know you were'nt implying that specifically, but the thing is, I only saw mention of the emails , OSA and Laws on Marty's blog after it was posted here. Someone else posted the presumption of the Marty involvement as an original reporting source but in a later post by another, it was discounted as incorrect. Just thought it important to to put the brakes on any further misinformation on where the email was first reported publicly.
     
  16. Panda Termint

    Panda Termint Cabal Of One

    No offence taken, Mary. Good thinking on setting the record straight. :)
     
  17. Ogsonofgroo

    Ogsonofgroo Crusader

    Great posting Emma :)cake: & :cheers:), I think most everyone is on track about the entire latest dramas. Really, most of the folks here, even 'damage done', have read the mail, so ta speak, and hopefully have taken a quick look at their actions and attitudes to a point to where this will be a much more helpful place for those what needs some calm and sensible.

    R.E.S.P.E.C.T.


    Now, lets git this party started (again!) :party: :dance: :party:

    :)
     
  18. namaste

    namaste Silver Meritorious Patron

  19. Sindy

    Sindy Crusader

    You're so cool Emma :love2:
     
  20. freet43

    freet43 Patron with Honors

    From friends that have been auditing outside the Co$ for decades, I've heard that one way to tell if someone that shows up on your lines is OSA is that these folks spend a lot of your time with questions and, although claiming to want services, never actually do any services. In several of such instances, these auditors later confirmed that the person was OSA or a plant and that is how this "rule" became recognized. That seems to align with current church "think" - ie: anyone that does a service outside the church is barred from ever receiving services in the church from there on out.

    I know many many Freezoners and not a single one would ever want to align with the co$ again. I have heard there are some in Marty's camp that think that way, but don't know any of them personally - it is just hearsay.

    I am friends with several people in Marty's camp, but none of them have ever expressed to me that they would ever rejoin the church should Miscavige be booted.

    This doesn't mean there aren't any Freezoners that would like the church revived, just anyone I know has moved beyond thinking that might be a good idea.

    Veda, I can't speak for other orgs or missions, but I know for a fact that folder culling did not go on at the mission I was at up to the point that I left in 79. How do I know? I was in the know of everything that went on at the mission for the last three years before I left..., as I was Qual Sec and second in command and was consulted on most everything.(When the ED was out of town for training or auditing, or the one time he did lower conditions, I filled in as acting ED).

    I have since heard from old staff friends that joined the GO after I left, and one of their biggest beefs was that pc folder culling had begun. They knew, because they were required to do that - and each of them left staff shortly after receiving such assignments.

    Marina
     
    Last edited: Jan 19, 2011