For Those Who Can't Stand Criticism

[olska]

@ Sweeness and Light:

To my first post on this thread, you responded with

Is this your way of saying that you have no thoughts to contribute to the conversation?

If so, that's o.k....but why comment on it unless you are just trolling the thread?

There were more than 240 posts on the thread before mine, many of them non sequiter to the op. What was it that made you suggest that mine was "trolling?"

I really want to know.

 

[olska]

If you had a choice between 2 things:

1. A jackpot of 1 million dollars

2. The chance to have a person that you don't particularly like accurately tell you everything wrong with you

Which would you choose?

Which would be more valuable?

I want to withdraw my first response to your op (but leave it on the thread so readers aren't confused), because I misread/ mistook your premise. What I read in #2 was not what you actually wrote, but rather:

2. The chance to have a person that doesn't particularly like you accurately tell you everything wrong with you

Difference bolded; different meaning than what you wrote.

But I'd still choose the million.

 

[Enthetan]

As Blip says, this is quite a post.

I agree totally.

For me, living a life of meaning is worth way more than a million dollars.

To reframe the question, then:

Which would you choose:

1. A jackpot of a million dollars
2. A meaningful lifetime

Huh???

For me personally, my meaningful lifetime involves my seeing to it that my kids grow up decently, and are able to be self-supporting at least at the middle-class standard of living they grew up in. When the last is out of the house, it may involve re-thinking but perhaps by that point the oldest will give me grand-kids that I can inflict myself on.

There was one point where I was offered a senior position in a large corporation. It would have involved moving to a different state, and long hours which would have made me unable to supervise my kids education to the degree I wanted. I turned it down. (It was just as well -- the company had just been acquired by another company, and the acquiring company would likely have replaced me with one of their own anyway)

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I personally don't like to stand for criticism, I usually take a seat and make sure I'm comfortable before it hits me.
I accept criticism in the spirit with which it is given and, like all of us here, I'm already living a meaningful life.

I'm with you, Panda!

I guess I see criticism as a useful tool, more as data or feedback, even though the word is loaded toward a negative connotation.

If someone calls me a "turkey", and I know I'm not a turkey...is it a true or realistic criticism of my actions or behavior that I should take on board and utilize? However, if someone (friend or foe) calls me out on some destructive action or lack of constructive action or obtuseness on my part, that I need to take responsibility for, then I want to hear it...even if the hearing of it is painful.

BUT, like Panda, I may chose my time and place and emotional space, and I may be sitting down for it (hopefully at the beach, which is where I feel most at "all right" and at peace in the world.)

 

[SweetnessandLight]

Arg!!!

Olska, I'm trying to get caught up here on this thread and do want to fully respond to all your posts with a thoughtful communication, but I am getting bumped off the computer at this moment...

Arg...I'm so sorry! I promise I will get back on asap to complete the comm!

 

[SchwimmelPuckel]

Who's critizising?

 

[Enthetan]

One of my Aikido Senseis (teachers) taught me to seek out the person or people in any group that was most difficult and antagonistic to my personality, and to sit with, work with and train with that person, despite my desire to play with the people I liked and enjoyed being with, as they are the ones who will be my greatest teachers (about my self and the way I interact with others in particular as well as life in general) out of the entire group.

I see these seeming "clashes" of minds or personalities here on the board very much in the light of that.

This is why I enjoy my sparring sessions with "The Anabaptist Jacques" and "Chuck Norris Cuts My Lawn" on the off topic threads. (Whether they are having fun is another story...)

 

[FinallyMe]

--- snip ---.

If someone calls me a "turkey", and I know I'm not a turkey...is it a true or realistic criticism of my actions or behavior that I should take on board and utilize? --- snip ---

But what if you ARE a turkey? Alanzo's question posited that the stranger "accurately" critized you -- what if that person pointed out something true about you which you had not previously recognized?

 

[Free to shine]

But what if you ARE a turkey? Alanzo's question posited that the stranger "accurately" critized you -- what if that person pointed out something true about you which you had not previously recognized?

How would you know it was true?

 

[nexus100]

But what if you ARE a turkey? Alanzo's question posited that the stranger "accurately" critized you -- what if that person pointed out something true about you which you had not previously recognized?

GOBBLE GOBBLE!

 

[degraded being]

How would you know it was true?

That is the most difficult part of Alanzo's challenge, IMO. The person is known to be accurate, so if they say something then it will undoubtedly be true, but a fault they point out may have never been noticed before, or may have been thought of as a virtue.
Having written this, I now think that if this did actually happen, then the person on the receiving end of the criticism would get used to criticism without getting too upset about it, because they would presumably change themselves and this would always (in theory) have a positive outcome, so criticism from the *always accurate* person would feel useful rather than threatening.

 

[degraded being]

BTW, is Alanzo setting himself up to be our always accurate criticzer cult leader. First step, get agreement.

 

[FinallyMe]

Nope. First, the criticism sent me into a tailspin. It took me years to figure out that the guy's "observation" was correct, and that what he was talking about was creating a LOT of problems for me. It was a relief to find out what was wrong with me. BUT, there was no one around who could tell me how to fix it. What do I do, if I don't do what I've done for my whole life? You don't just "change things" if you haven't a clue what to change it TO. That's the problem with being criticized by someone who isn't going to hang in there to help you out with some suggestions, some feedback, some support. And none of my friends ever had that problem, so they could not offer help in how to get out of it.

 

[nexus100]

Nope. First, the criticism sent me into a tailspin. It took me years to figure out that the guy's "observation" was correct, and that what he was talking about was creating a LOT of problems for me. It was a relief to find out what was wrong with me. BUT, there was no one around who could tell me how to fix it. What do I do, if I don't do what I've done for my whole life? You don't just "change things" if you haven't a clue what to change it TO. That's the problem with being criticized by someone who isn't going to hang in there to help you out with some suggestions, some feedback, some support. And none of my friends ever had that problem, so they could not offer help in how to get out of it.

So what are you doing now?

 

[FinallyMe]

Posting on ESMB, where I can run and hide as necessary, without anyone knowing that.

 

[nexus100]

Posting on ESMB, where I can run and hide as necessary, without anyone knowing that.

LOL!

 

[SweetnessandLight]

I want to withdraw my first response to your op (but leave it on the thread so readers aren't confused), because I misread/ mistook your premise. What I read in #2 was not what you actually wrote, -snip-

Difference bolded; different meaning than what you wrote.

But I'd still choose the million.

Fair enough! Maybe this clears things up a bit more...we were discussing accurate criticism of self, by others, it's use and value. My postings regarding this were not off the topic of the thread.

Yes, there are all sorts of little divergences and entertainments and jokes that take place on a thread, much as at a dinner party with lively discussions and conversation largely flowing around or coming back to one main topic. It's what makes these threads interesting and fun, I think. Also helps to keep us all from getting too serious.

I realize Alanzo has a bit of a hidden agenda of a sort here, but that's o.k., I love him anyway and will happily play along as I feel that the topic is a useful and sufficiently general one to benefit many. Especially when you consider how much unfair mud is flung in the faces of COS members by COS admin, as we are largely a board of Exes and Critics.

I think I understand you better now, Olska, especially since you feel you are getting plenty of criticism here on ESMB (not necessarily the useful, accurate kind! Sorry to hear that.) Thanks for elaborating.

I guess I wondered if you were just chiming in to say how stupid you thought Alanzo's post was, for the sake of flaming him (I consider that trolling behavior; disruptive, rude, unproductive negative comments on others' writing) or if you had something to contribute to the conversation, and it turns out you did, and do. Thank you!

For instance, if a person REALLY thinks the premise of a thread is stupid, why bother to post on it at all? Why not go play on another thread that appeals to you more? I think that's what I was questioning. That's all. I'm not really calling you a troll! Does this fully answer your question?

For Finally Me:
Originally Posted by SweetnessandLight
--- snip ---.
If someone calls me a "turkey", and I know I'm not a turkey...is it a true or realistic criticism of my actions or behavior that I should take on board and utilize? --- snip ---

But what if you ARE a turkey? Alanzo's question posited that the stranger "accurately" critized you -- what if that person pointed out something true about you which you had not previously recognized?

I think I already answered that earlier in saying:"However, if someone (friend or foe) calls me out on some destructive action or lack of constructive action or obtuseness on my part, that I need to take responsibility for, then I want to hear it...even if the hearing of it is painful."

Let me rephrase this here: What if somebody called me "stupid" and I know that I am not stupid? I was talking about selecting which criticisms might be accurate and which to take to heart, based on that accuracy..."Know Thy Self"...some of us do know ourselves pretty well, after much long study and patient labor (hard work)!

Nexy, clearly I am not a turkey....a peacock, maybe!!!

 

[olska]

<>
if a person REALLY thinks the premise of a thread is stupid, why bother to post on it at all? Why not go play on another thread that appeals to you more? I think that's what I was questioning.
<>

Got it.

 

[Arthur Dent]

If you had a choice between 2 things:

1. A jackpot of 1 million dollars

2. The chance to have a person that you don't particularly like accurately tell you everything wrong with you

Which would you choose?

Which would be more valuable?

I am often surprised at how long some threads get! Now, that's not a criticism...

Ok, so I would take the million first off. And because I don't like to be told I have to choose.... I would then tell the person they could tell me what's wrong with me if they wanted. If they refused I would just pay them to do it. Experience tells me this is how it's done, no??

 

[Lurker5]

Accurate

Accurate criticism strikes the buttons on me, and sets me off.

I usually, under calmer conditions, later on, think about it - and then sheepishly, humbly, apologize if that is called for. Done that a lot .

However, when someone, while in an argument with me, goes for a button - in order to throw me off - and it is usually nasty and having nothing at all to do with the issue at hand (accurate or not), it is a dirty swipe/blow. And that is like getting hit by a bat. That was the intent. I consider it dirty fighting - and it pisses me off. I stop, absorb the f'g blow, OWN IT if it is true - sometimes I own it even if it is not true - but just that person's opinion - and then I go for the throat . . . psychologically.

Nothing throws off this kind of dirty arguer more than owning the nasty comment - receiving it - to no affect - and then going for blood.

They started it. I have scared the hell out of a few bullies this way. Another tactic is to just walk away - leave 'em hanging, while you sort it out - WTF just happened there.

It is very hard to look into one's self - let alone own it - but the rewards are tremendous.

However, I'd take the million, and go think about it - myself - in some wonderful place. I'd probably turn out horrible - turn into a horrible person, but what the hey - worth the experience perhaps. As someone else said, I am fairly critical of myself, a lot. I learned along the way not to be brutalized by the criticism of others. One really does have to contemplate if it is accurate - and then deal with it accordingly. I can do that fairly well now, and could maybe do that with a million too . I'd like to think so, but then, what do I know . . . I'd like the chance to find out . . .