ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

Golden Quotes from ESMB

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by SweetnessandLight, Aug 10, 2009.

  1. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

    Panda Termint

    Default Re: What caused a statistically significant decline in traffic recently for ESMB ?

    This thread is done. It was done from the outset but garnered a few good laughs along the way. Thanks to all who contributed to the mirth.

    We've had posters here predicting and bewailing the imminent demise of ESMB for as long as I've been reading here. It always reminds me of Hubbard's dire predictions about the fate of mankind. You know, "five more years" and all that!

    I'm not saying the doomsday-prophets are acting like Hubbard... or maybe I am.

    Sometimes it strikes me that, to some people, "Keeping Criticism Working" really is a deadly serious activity and the whole agonised future of every man, woman and child here on Planet Earth depends on what we do here and now on ESMB!

    This is probably why we can't have nice things.

    Classic Panda!
  2. AnonyMary

    AnonyMary Formerly Fooled - Finally Free

    A Golden statement made by TheOriginalBigBlue, in response to wtfdidigetmyselfinto's comment.

    1st August 2015, 04:01 PM #90
    Re: The whole fucking forum

    Re: Comment by wtfdidigetmyselfinto

    Note: The OP has posted under several different threads in a short period of time and the subject matter has become a bit confusing for those who are coming in mid topic. I suggest reviewing the OP's posting history if they are interested in the full context.

    WTF, I still consider myself to be relatively new here. A lot of these guys have been participating since 2007ish. There can be a learning curve and getting used to what to expect. I strongly advise that you treat PMs with a high degree of caution. It is possible to get to know who some of the posters are and how they fit in the Ex community but giving identifiable information to an unknown PM is not much different than posting it in the forum.

    Next - Scientology is a bait and switch. This is the universal lesson for Exes. The question about whether Scientologists are evil is academic because people get into it on the promise of self improvement and helping others. If people got into it because it promised an improved ability to abuse and deceive people then you could say Scientologists were fundamentally evil. But unless they are born into it like some that we know, Scientologists start out expecting one thing and ultimately end up doing another. You have seen and liked the bait, now stick around and find out about the "switch".

    I have defended you in your comment about the pay which has become something of a flash point, but to be fair I must also defend those who had a reaction of visceral incredulity. There is easily 45 years of collective Scientology pay scale history represented here and levels of $500. - $600. per week in any org is unreal to most of us. The inclination to burrow down into the details is hard to resist.

    Developing mental techniques to make the needle float is an essential survival skill to long time Scientology public and staff alike. As a group we should impress the FBI as to how lie detectors can be fooled. Public have to make that needle float or they are looking at retreads and auditing repair actions that can cost 10s of thousands of dollars plus travel and hotel expenses and time away from family and work. For Sea Org members it can save you or get you released from the RPF. This is a major clue that all is not right in paradise when you find yourself actively resisting detection of thought crime.

    If harsh judicial measures were applied to the public then there would be no public. They aren't that stupid. They live and die by PR. What you experience as justice as public or even as staff in a non-SO unit is not as harsh. Scientology is initially presented as a self help philosophy and reasonable people think about it as though it is something they have control over in their personal lives when they first study it. However, it is all part of a cohesive system that is intended to be applied within the organizational structure of the church for the benefit of LRH - now DM. Jeffrey Augustine's excellent analysis of the legal structure of the church confirms this. We see in your postings how you are trying to reason with the tenets of Scientology. These are deliberately designed to override your own intuition in a way that makes you increasingly compliant with that organizational system. These Ethics and judicial philosophies are the central component that provides control and an insulated environment.

    Scientology appeals to certain kinds of people because they already have values, interests and mental quirks that coincide with it. This would be a good time to re-evaluate everything you have learned and to define what is natively you and what is indoctrination. If you do not do this now, then like many of us you will have to do it later and the longer you are in the harder it becomes.

    You initially came here seeking help. It may have been a knee jerk response to the Recruiters looking at you like a wolf looks at a lamb but your intuition was still the correct one. I imagine some young upstart walking into a meeting of old Shriners who have known each other for 60 years and yelling, "Oh my God!, who the hell are all you people!?" Now that you are here, please ask some pointed questions that can help you.

    From what I know of you I'm going to recommend Chris Shelton:
  3. Free Being Me

    Free Being Me Crusader

    :) :thumbsup: :yes:
  4. looker

    looker Patron Meritorious

    When in the course of Scientology events BE, DO, HAVE. turns into "I BEEN DONE HAD", one elevates to a new level of consciousness and freedom. :) Paraphrased from Mystic.
  5. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    ^reported for spam
  6. TrevAnon

    TrevAnon Big List researcher

    LOL. There were two posts above this one with spam, and a mod took care of it. (Thanks!)

    However now it looks like I reported Looker's post for spam. :biggrin:
  7. SchwimmelPuckel

    SchwimmelPuckel Genuine Meatball

    ^^ Shit! - The mods may keep going and this whole thread gets it!!! :ohmy:
  8. Leland

    Leland Crusader

    "Shut your gob" posted by Just Sheila ... :p

    Sheila endeared herself to me...when she posted that....
    Last edited: Nov 10, 2015
  9. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

  10. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Posted by: JustSheila

    They may start out thinking they're doing the right thing, but then when their consciences twinge that it might be wrong, they resolve those twinges in sessions. So then they are 'with the group' and the individual conscience is subservient to the group's demands. The group rewards them when they ignore their individual desires, passions or personal moral codes and keeps replacing these with the group conscience.

    We don't normally deal with real humans when we deal with OSA Scientologists here. Instead, we deal with the Hubbard personality, the Scientology personality, the thick, thick, unbreakable veneer that is reinforced with TRs, ethics, group justice and constantly studying and modeling in clay how what they are doing for the group is more important than anyone else, anything else - including themselves, their hearts, the dreams they gave up, their families, their love.

    Any short break, any loving relationship, any family member outside Scientology, any reading of the Internet outside Scn approved items can shatter the control and rejuvenate the individual. So they are monitored to ensure they do not 'fall into the hands of SPs' - which really means, get their own freedom and lives back.

    Some are so fearful and jealous of others who might get their freedom that they take extraordinary actions to ensure no opportunity ever exists for anyone who might think freely and live freely outside the Scientology trap.

    Even so, they all stop believing it after a while - you can only stop your conscience for so long - and just do it because the routines are ingrained and responses automatic. Thinking means quoting Hubbard. Doing means working to expand Scientology. Freedom means freedom to devote your life to Scientology. Because it's all they've known for so long, they are afraid they will never find their way back to themselves.

    Many don't. They just get lost in the delusions, seeing spaceships, waiting for some final OT level that will never come, imagining they've achieved exotic, amazing superpowerz, lying to others about it, but more importantly, lying to themselves. Because to admit it was all a scam would hurt so much, it's so hard to swallow, so difficult to take.

    When we see them here, they're really nasty. They don't see us as humans - they are at war and we are de-humanized with labels like PTS, DB, SP, WOG, and any other derogatory label that makes them feel they are superior for using it.

    But they are just a shell, just a Hubbardian construct, just the Scientology false personality.

    Yeh, once, long ago, they meant well. Then they betrayed their own consciences. When they stop shutting off that inner voice that reminds them that they are not living their lives as they intended, then they might see or hear something here. Until then, it's in the delusionary world of Scientology, the world of imagination where someone told you everything you imagined is real and used a crappy device that registers on everything from commercials on TV to remembering a cockroach crawl to imagining a hippo run. It registers on every child's fairytale you ever read. They believe it is real because they believe L Ron spoke the truth to them and he said the e-meter registered actual memories, not fantasies.

    Like we used to believe.

    They are so screwed up. But if they want their lives back, we'll help them. They need to first realize that Hubbard lied to them and stop pretending and lying to us.
  11. ForLease

    ForLease Maximus Squirrel

    Found this on Rinder's Blog, wanted to give it a little more love...

  12. Cat Daddy

    Cat Daddy Silver Meritorious Patron

    Tell me ecxactly why you wanted that
  13. Cat Daddy

    Cat Daddy Silver Meritorious Patron

  14. ForLease

    ForLease Maximus Squirrel

    Well, I found it a great quote about avoiding codependent, enabling relationships, but whatever floats your boat...
  15. Cat Daddy

    Cat Daddy Silver Meritorious Patron

  16. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Cross-posted from another thread:

  17. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Hi Storm,

    Nah, you didn't cause any upset. Curiosity, though, for sure! We have all kinds that come here - trolls that don't have a clue about scn but are peddling something else, true believers that practice scn outside the official 'church', self-appointed gurus who take bits and pieces of scn and interpret it their way and deliver another version... all sorts. True believers of scn have apparently financially supported a few to live quite well, and those looking into it can sometimes be easy marks for a good sales pitch. So it's always good to watch out for private messages from strangers offering solutions to problems and I wanted Chloe to know that. She's a lot younger than you, from her description, and not as worldly. She hasn't been here long.

    Then we also have the real exes, and there are all sorts of those, too. I've been a member here far longer than it looks, as I had another ID before this one. I believe your background. What's not clear is what happened between then and now, but you are under no obligation to tell that, either. Obviously, you still believe somewhat in scientology. I don't. Clearly, you have the reg/auditor/C/S background, as your first impulse was to 'handle the ARCxen public' or the 'bitter defrocked apostates' or the 'disaffected field' or whatever group label comes to mind when you think of exscientologists. So your intention was sweet, and I still think that's sweet, if misplaced. 

    You asked a few questions on here, questions that those who have been out of touch with the scientology world outside the official church/cult of scientology would ask.

    The FREEZONE are the people practicing scientology outside the official cult of scientology. Like freelancers. Then there are the Independent Scientologists, who are basically believers in scientology but against the official cult/church and its head, David Miscavige. That group basically believes the problems of scientology are from its management. Then there are others that one wonders why they left at all, because some have set up their own little groups that look just like the cult, sound like the cult and abuse others like the cult, but maybe pay their staff a bit better.

    Then there are the exes, the Anons (never in scn but against the abuses), and also the scn watchers, since all the media attention, lawsuits and government shutdowns of scientology as a fraud since so much exposure of the crimes committed by the cult and by scientologists.

    There's a lot going on! Considering that some 99% or so of the people who ever started in scientology left it, there are hundreds of thousands of people or more who have had a bad experience with scn and have more than a passing interest in exposing, stopping and prosecuting the crimes of the cult. Those people also have family, friends and associates, so multiply that number again by at least six.

    It's all very exciting!

    There are dozens of busy websites to accommodate all this interest, and exscn is just one of them, but it is one of the oldest sites, too. As far as believers in scn, on a 1-10, we're more of a 2. There are a few freezoners here, though, and exscn is known to handle a variety of different people better than most sites. It keeps discussions interesting, that's for sure.

    You asked about moderators, etc. If it's not against the forum rules, you're fine. 

    Here on exscn, you can find out what went on behind the scenes at any given period of scientology. You can find out how L Ron ordered the things he did, how he actually died, what he was really like, how the tek was developed and many other things that we were never allowed to discuss when we were in the church.

    And we can joke and laugh about scientology now, because we know that every man woman and child on the planet does NOT depend on it.  Hubbard used expansive, extreme rhetoric and other techniques to convince others he had the 'solution to insanity,' but when things went wrong (as they nearly always did), he blamed the auditors, the C/Ses, even the individuals. He canceled all the original Class VIII's certificates, he Declared SP nearly everyone from the 'good 'ol Saint Hill days'. It was everyone's fault the tek didn't work, you see, except Hubbard. 

    So enjoy yourself. Have a good read. If you have any questions, shoot them at us. You've got some catching up to do... and there's a lot.

    Welcome again.

    x x x

  18. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

  19. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    From HelluvaHoax:

  20. Free Being Me

    Free Being Me Crusader