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In defence of Hubbard

guanoloco

As-Wased
If I am right, Paulette Cooper was fair gamed (by Hubbard) and this should never have happened. Was there false evidence placed by GO to discredit Cooper under Hubbard's order? I didn't verify that but personally I believe yes, it was.

Now, I didn't read Paulette Coopers book so I wouldn't know what's in it. Were there only facts, docs and evidence? Or was she writing personal opinions, hearsay or overly discrediting Scientology? Scientology wasn't that bad back then.

It's you who ruthlessly reveals truth. What's in the book? Would it pass your criteria of research?

The Scandal of Scientology

The book isn't all that in-depth and just has the basic surface yap about Scientology. It doesn't even really portray Hubbard in all that negative of a light, IIRC. His reaction is drastic, insane, un-called-for and way over the top...you'd think she really uncovered some major withholds by his reaction. Then I read the book and it's sort of a let down considering Ron's mad dash over the ramparts straight up and vertical all hands attack with seven division, twenty-one department orgs in overdrive to get that SP.
 

afaceinthecrowd

Gold Meritorious Patron
The Scandal of Scientology

The book isn't all that in-depth and just has the basic surface yap about Scientology. It doesn't even really portray Hubbard in all that negative of a light, IIRC. His reaction is drastic, insane, un-called-for and way over the top...you'd think she really uncovered some major withholds by his reaction. Then I read the book and it's sort of a let down considering Ron's mad dash over the ramparts straight up and vertical all hands attack with seven division, twenty-one department orgs in overdrive to get that SP.

"The guilty dog always barks the loudest."
 

Ogsonofgroo

Crusader
IMO, the OP is using "Hubbardthink" to belittle the corroborated reports from numerous sources he knows nothing about and morale equivalence to whitewash Hisself's crimes and gloss over the real El Ron. :coolwink:

Face:)

I'm inclined to agree Face, pretty typical tactic for Hubbard apologists imho, along with glossing over the fuckery, minimalizing the massive damage done to so many people and families, and attempting to trivialize it... lordy, its not Thursday is it?
Hm, seems 'Ballsonfire' has left the building, leaving nothing of substance in Its wake as usual *sigh*

An old short thread I started here, regarding the TR's~ FOUND HERE, the important point is, I think, is whether aware of it or not, people trying to paint Hubbard's pig fall into the same lame patterns time-after-time.
Kind of pathetic imho, but quite understandable.

:cheers:
 

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
Why do Exes hate Hubbard?

For my standards or what I am used to, I consider Hubbard still a decent guy. Not much wrong with him really. It keeps on surprising me why Exes making fuss about Hubbard's shortcomings while ignoring their own.

Or could it be that Exes have no personal shortcomings, being perfect parents, good daughters and sons, never took government handouts or pretended to be sick when they weren't, never lied in their CV's, always stood up to their principles based on their own high ethical values?

Please let me know what are your thoughts about it?

"Hubbard a decent guy. Not much wrong with him really." ???

This has to be a joke or a deliberately provocative post. If you're serious, read up on R2-45 and then we'll talk, Balthasar.

It's one thing to drink the Kool-aid yourself. It's another thing to put on a red fat suit to disco music, and crash through the ceiling holding a pitcher with ice, expecting everyone else to drink it with you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oYS7aQY1iZI
 

Gib

Crusader
He assembled spiritual knowledge and made it accessible. Under his tutorship many good methods of self improvement were developed and categorized.

That he later incorrectly claimed he was the only source and presented himself as a super being is sad and regrettable. There was no need for doing so. But that's life - never perfect :)

I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, and even some rocks give more of a reaction me, but

what exactly are you talking about "assembled spiritual knowledge"? Do you mean the ARC, KRC, cycle of action stuff? Or possibly the account of all us humans past lives as explained by El Ron in "History of Man"?
 

Xenu's Boyfriend

Silver Meritorious Patron
Or maybe, since you're apologizing for him, you agree with Hubbard, Balthasar, and you'd like to see a future with Scientology children as he envisioned them. All ripe for the Sea Org and their billion year contracts, like these children.

You're defending a man who created a world of nightmares for so many. People who never spoke to their families again.

Start both commercials at the exact same time and you'll hear what a "decent guy" L. Ron Hubbard was.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i_u_AZjYm0A

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=44e-Y08_B-0
 
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OhMG

Patron Meritorious
I'm not the sharpest tool in the shed, and even some rocks give more of a reaction me, but

what exactly are you talking about "assembled spiritual knowledge"? Do you mean the ARC, KRC, cycle of action stuff? Or possibly the account of all us humans past lives as explained by El Ron in "History of Man"?

Or ... BT's
AnimatedGhost1.gif
 

Gadfly

Crusader
I left my Scientology mindset long, long ago behind you can trust me on that. I just don't like hypocrisy, whining and self-pity.

It was always my impression that Hubbard was doing a great job, as far as he could at least.

Just because I am posting here doesn't mean that I am automatically a Hubbard hater. Nor does it mean that I share any opinions expressed here or elsewhere.

You left the mindset long ago? So you CLAIM. Trust you on that? :hysterical:

I will go on what I observe, and not on what you assert. I long ago learned, mainly from my experiences in Scientology, NOT to so easily trust and accept the claims, assertions and statements of others. I do follow Hubbard's advise on this - look don't listen!

Tossing around words like "nattering" and "denigrating" shows different.

What "job" exactly was Hubbard doing great at? Other than creating a very smooth-operating mind control cult that brilliantly sucked/sucks money, time and energy out of mostly decent people.
 

afaceinthecrowd

Gold Meritorious Patron
I'm inclined to agree Face, pretty typical tactic for Hubbard apologists imho, along with glossing over the fuckery, minimalizing the massive damage done to so many people and families, and attempting to trivialize it... lordy, its not Thursday is it?
Hm, seems 'Ballsonfire' has left the building, leaving nothing of substance in Its wake as usual *sigh*

An old short thread I started here, regarding the TR's~ FOUND HERE, the important point is, I think, is whether aware of it or not, people trying to paint Hubbard's pig fall into the same lame patterns time-after-time.
Kind of pathetic imho, but quite understandable.

:cheers:

Yep!:thumbsup:

The tactics are; obfuscate by berate, justify by vilify, minimize and trivialize through mesmerized eyes, bleating swallowed lies.:yes:

Face:)
 

AnonKat

Crusader
David miscavige ready for Tom

[video=youtube;XyNh1j3dsp8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XyNh1j3dsp8[/video]
 
Obviously, you have not read much, if any, of my Posts and words on ESMB re: El Ron and my time in Hisselfs personal service. I won't repeat all 100,000 plus words here...you are free to go read them anytime you wish so that you are better informed regarding my "Take", thoughts, interactions, observations, opinions and actions during those years.

"Nattering" is a Scio mindfuck term and meaningless to me at this point in my life. I tell what I saw, thought and felt and, if you ever took the time to read my stuff, you'll see that most of my opinions re: El Ron were formed by being around Hisself and is one of the "Drivers" of my leaving. I saw El Ron do some very degenerate & cruel stuff and if chronicling that and stating my opinion is "denigrating" to you, so be it.

I left rather than continue being a party to the madness...I knew Hisself was loosing what marbles Hisself had...and have written about that a number of times on ESMB, with specifics. I stood up, face to Face and went toe-to-toe with DM personally and other CMO on several occasions before doing so, and have written about that on ESMB, also. You're right, I did not confront El Ron re: Hisselfs BS, and I've said this before on ESMB and apologized and chastised myself for not calling Hisself down on a number of occasions back then.

I was young when I arrived on the Apollo and for years truly thought for all Hisself's grievous faults I was learning more and more about that the "Tech" was important to the future well being of Humankind. I was wrong, I was under "The Spell" as, apparently, you still are, as well. I understand what that is like and you have my deepest sympathy and sorrow you suffer this condition...Truly.

A couple of other things...

I wasn't "shitting in my pants". You don't know me, Sir or anything about me or my past other than what I have written on this Board, of which you apparently have read very little. I was rationalizing, acquiescing and trying navigate and make sense of Hisself's bizarre world I had singed myself into servitude in. I had 3 young children and a wife to fend for and raise and there was no effen way I was gonna go open my mouth after I left. Why? Well, if you don't know the answer to that, you have either never been a Father or your children's well being and their futures were not all that much important to you, and you certainly give El Ron and Scn a "Pass" on Fair Game and viciously targeting anyone that says the truth, exposes the lies and thereby tarnishes the Myth of El Ron's persona.

Yeah, it's easier now that Hisself is dead, a whole lot easier...thanks to all the courageous Folks that have fought the beast for decades at great sacrifice and peril. My children are raised, educated and thriving, I put my wife (now ex) through college and she remarried and is doing very well. I am retired now and my finances are secure and untouchable. I write about El Ron to help others fit together their Tiles to the Mosaic, corroborate the Tiles placed down by others re: El Ron and purge my Soul and Heart. I make no dough nor gain personal notoriety for it.

So, what's your Point?

I'm a chicken shit liar and weasel and the multitude of others that knew El Ron and have told their stories re: Hisself are cut of the same cloth as me and the fact that our stories corroborate, parallel and add to each others is because we are some "Cabal" of unworthy Lackeys trying to "besmirch El Ron's 'good name'" because of our "Overts" on Hisself?

Pray tell, I'm all ears.:yes:


Face:)

jay-zissssss...

i GOTTA read your body of work on this board face

but tell me something

ok...

you're definitely on record as holding with the elron is a scumbag set

but...

are you at all willing to allow that there is yet genius in his work?
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
The Scandal of Scientology

The book isn't all that in-depth and just has the basic surface yap about Scientology. It doesn't even really portray Hubbard in all that negative of a light, IIRC. His reaction is drastic, insane, un-called-for and way over the top...you'd think she really uncovered some major withholds by his reaction. Then I read the book and it's sort of a let down considering Ron's mad dash over the ramparts straight up and vertical all hands attack with seven division, twenty-one department orgs in overdrive to get that SP.

I agree. This is a very mild and not all that in-depth book, considering the three that came after in the 80's and more recently with Janet Reitman and Larry Wright.

What a lot of Kool-Aid people don't consider is that if you're a historical figure, very intrusive books are going to be written about you and it can't be stopped. The nooks and crannies and potential withholds of your life will all be examined with a fine-toothed comb.

I believe about 16,000 books have been written about Lincoln and even 1,000 about the movie star Marilyn Monroe.

If you're going to push out the idea into society that you're the next earth Savior, the next (maybe even reincarnated) Buddha, I can pretty well bet that there will be some books written over time. Better have your tolerance (havingness, that is :)) for your life to be laid out bare and having no more privacy in really good shape. It will all come out. A historical figure thing. Sorry.

How could one not know and not expect it coming?

Why the drama? :omg:

Never could figure this one out. :confused2:

I think that his not coming clean about his life, not writing an authentic and true autobiography when he could have, has probably permanently torpedoed his body of work and any good* that could have come out of it.

*Humor me please about the "good" part. That debate is on another thread.
:nervous:
 
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The Scientology-mindset maybe, but obviously not the Hubbardist-mindset....

to the dumbass shrinks there is no such thing as actual thinking there are only "mindsets"

a person can do his or her own thinking and speak of genius in ron's work without being caught in anyone's mindset
 

Gadfly

Crusader
He assembled spiritual knowledge and made it accessible. Under his tutorship many good methods of self improvement were developed and categorized.

That he later incorrectly claimed he was the only source and presented himself as a super being is sad and regrettable. There was no need for doing so. But that's life - never perfect :)

"spiritual knowledge"

:hysterical:

What he assembled was a grand PRETENSE of "spiritual knowledge". I have never met even ONE "Scientologist", and I have met many, who appeared advanced spiritually in any way. Often the opposite was true, partially due to Hubbard's propensity for lying, materialistic concerns, gaudy showiness and superficial appearances.

Scientology is a severe CARTOON of the spiritual. It is a sick caricature. It is phony, and claims to be what it actually is not.

Show me ANY person who has advanced spiritually through Scientology (outside of their imagination and subjective delusions of exaggerated self-worth and superiority)?
 
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