Is the cult insolvent?

[Anonycat]

Well yeah. In no way do I regard dm as a scientologist. scientology for him is a tool to achieve power and money. But that said, it's still the only world he knows and the only world he has any control over. He could maybe live like an ex-nazi in Brazil or somewhere but I have to wonder if he could ever actually make that step. There are no guarantees that that would work. I guess time will tell but the world probably seems pretty dangerous when you've fucked as many people as he has.

I'm sure he'd love to really pull it off, and retire to a compound within easy flying time to Tom Cruise, or even a nice place in the L.A. area. And do his hobnobbing until he discovers that people you hit at work really don't respect you and want to be around you anymore. Then yeah, move somewhere else.

 

[Ho Tai]

So, what is wrong with these people who keep takin' it day after day, month after month?

Not only do they keep takin' it, they turn around and reg their friends and family members. I no longer have once ounce of empathy or sympathy for those still in...NONE.

I've had enough of the justifications of what these people are doing. They KNOW.

I don't know how they sleep at night.

Oh my, I have had a revelation. I had been feeling guilty for not having empathy for the poor souls still in chains. Your post has freed me, at least for the moment. I know people who will stay in forever, no matter what. But I used to think I was one of those people too. Yet here I am. So perhaps the right attitude is to assume that each person will continue to observe what is going on and some, in his/her own time, will awaken and GTFO. Some will stay committed to the bitter end (and it will be bitter).

 

[Sindy]

Is the cult insolvent? I think it already is. I think that the push for IAS donations to up peoples' membership level is being used to fund the day to day running of the Orgs all round the planet.

I'm going to go out on a limb with a wild theory but I don't care, it works for me

Towards the end, before I left, I was dumbfounded at how far Miscavige was willing to push the parishioners and yet people just kept taking it and it got so extreme -- a MAJOR pressure cooker. I would look around and wonder how people could "keep the faith" so to speak.

In the end, there is always a method to madness and a logic behind everything anyone does, even a sociopath like Miscavige.

Miscavige is a coward with a capital "C" so in my opinion, he is not doing this alone. He's having conversations with someone, every day, about the lemmings under him and placing bets about how far he can push.

He doesn't care if people leave, clearly. I don't think anyone, including Miscavige can front up to all this horrible press, courtroom drama, explosive book after explosive book, almost an entire family abandoning him (one of which is about to do a major book tour of her own), Debbie Cook, Marty et al, and the worst public opinion possible...all by himself -- no way.

So, who is or are his partners in crime? Who is bolstering this guy so he feels uber confident enough to push people to the absolute limit? What is their plan?

Miscavige is not stupid but he sure looks like he is...something ain't right. There are unknowns that when they come out, they will make this whole crazy escapade make sense.

 

[RolandRB]

I'm going to go out on a limb with a wild theory but I don't care, it works for me

Towards the end, before I left, I was dumbfounded at how far Miscavige was willing to push the parishioners and yet people just kept taking it and it got so extreme -- a MAJOR pressure cooker. I would look around and wonder how people could "keep the faith" so to speak.

In the end, there is always a method to madness and a logic behind everything anyone does, even a sociopath like Miscavige.

Miscavige is a coward with a capital "C" so in my opinion, he is not doing this alone. He's having conversations with someone, every day, about the lemmings under him and placing bets about how far he can push.

He doesn't care if people leave, clearly. I don't think anyone, including Miscavige can front up to all this horrible press, courtroom drama, explosive book after explosive book, almost an entire family abandoning him (one of which is about to do a major book tour of her own), Debbie Cook, Marty et al, and the worst public opinion possible...all by himself -- no way.

So, who is or are his partners in crime? Who is bolstering this guy so he feels uber confident enough to push people to the absolute limit? What is their plan?

Miscavige is not stupid but he sure looks like he is...something ain't right. There are unknowns that when they come out, they will make this whole crazy escapade make sense.

He does not care. He has no reason to care. The way the thing works is to get people to give money so that it goes uplines. It never goes downlines. He has been upping the uplines money flow for a long time and that is all that counts. He has done this extremely succesfully - much beter than LRH could have done.

It has got to the stage where very soon no more money will flow uplies because everything below it is broken. Let's face it, nobody wants to "get up the Bridge" and more so that's out. He has invented new things to get money out of people where they do not have to deliver a service in return.

Miscavige himself owns the approx. 2 billion dollars in the IAS warchest that is held in the form of gold bullion in Curacao so why should he care if the Orgs all go to hell. Looked at that way then it all makes sense and we can see he has done a very effective job.

 

[Sindy]

He does not care. He has no reason to care. The way the thing works is to get people to give money so that it goes uplines. It never goes downlines. He has been upping the uplines money flow for a long time and that is all that counts. He has done this extremely succesfully - much beter than LRH could have done.

It has got to the stage where very soon no more money will flow uplies because everything below it is broken. Let's face it, nobody wants to "get up the Bridge" and more so that's out. He has invented new things to get money out of people where they do not have to deliver a service in return.

Miscavige himself owns the approx. 2 billion dollars in the IAS warchest that is held in the form of gold bullion in Curacao so why should he care if the Orgs all go to hell. Looked at that way then it all makes sense and we can see he has done a very effective job.

Oh? Now it's 2 billion?

Miscavige absolutely does not, himself, own the money in the IAS coffers. That's not how it works.

 

[Dulloldfart]

Miscavige absolutely does not, himself, own the money in the IAS coffers. That's not how it works.

True. But if he can direct its disposition unhindered it's a distinction without a difference.

Paul

 

[Krautfag]

True. But if he can direct its disposition unhindered it's a distinction without a difference.

Paul

Some Anons have spent quite a bit of time trying to unravel the account network in Switzerland, Liechtenstein and Jersey and there are accounts within that network which usually have only one single holder of the right of disposal.

 

[Enthetan]

As someone that got out very recently, I can attest to this. The regging is really what did it for me. Even if you say you can't afford something, they still won't stop. When I said I couldn't afford the full basics package, and that i'd prefer to just get the books and lectures individually for now (even though I recognized it would cost more), I was told that I had to get a complete package of something (the books or the lectures), and that I had to leave with one or the other. Ended up getting the books, on credit card. They said while getting them one by one is ok, just having all of them (even if you don't read/listen to them) is better. Then, I wanted to put money towards Purif and TRs & Objectives, since I was interested in going up the Bridge. Instead, I was repeatedly told that I had to do the Basics, and that I should at least have the full package of Basics and courses before starting the Bridge. When I gave money for "services", I look at the receipt, and it's not towards the Purif/TRs as I wanted, but to the Basics courses. It seemed like, despite my interest in going up the Bridge in the way that worked best for me (i.e. pay for the next steps on the Bridge, and do the Basics one at a time, at least for now), they wanted to get as much money out of me as possible, as soon as possible.

They likely have intense pressure coming from "on high". Keep in mind that when you buy books/tapes, the money goes into a separate account -- which DM directly controls. If you buy Purif/TRs, then at least some of the money would have gone to the org. Also, the staff member who sells you the book package gets a commission.

 

[Enthetan]

I understand Enthetan.

I can assure you "crush regging" , including enticement and advice to commit pecuniary fraud existed in 1974.

Yes, I was around in the '70's. I did not experience it being anywhere near as bad as during the Basics rollout. They were relentless, multiple calls per night, every night, from various people.

 

[Enthetan]

Yeah that's the thing. I really have no idea how much money they have but they ARE acting desperate. Why?

Of course I learned a long time ago that you can't expect the acts of lunatics to make sense but you have to wonder what's going on in that little cultic universe which is causing them to turn up the heat so high. I mean if they have a billion dollars what's the reason for panic? Panic does make sense if they are running out of cash but once again you can't assume logic here. These people are whacked.

It doesn't matter if there's cash left in SO Reserves. What matters is cash flow. The staff is probably being told "You WILL get your GI up to the point where you can pay your bills AFTER sending Int Management their money off the top. If the org has to close because you can't pay your bills, EVERY SINGLE STAFF MEMBER will be inducted into the Sea Org and then RPF'ed for all eternity!!"

 

[oneonewasaracecar]

I( cannot speak to the org reserves but I can say that the IAS money is well over a billion and two billion could be a possibility.

By 1989 there was over $150 million in IAS reserves - fact.

By 1995 according to info I trust (but did not directly see) IAS Reserves were over 250 million.

80% by policy is in gold. in 1995 the price of gold was $380 per ounce price yesterday $1780

That alone would make IAS reserves worth $980 million dollars - and that does not include the money regged since 1995.

So, while I dont have some sort of balance sheet I can see with pretty good certainty that the IAS has well over a billion dollars.

When I read that the surveillance on Pat Broeker had ceased, my first thought was that the war chest had been seriously depleted. This is discouraging news.

If the war chest has not been depleted, what is your take on the cessation of surveillance on Pat Broeker?

 

[Enthetan]

After all of the discussion here I have to say that I really have no idea on how much money they have and any theory is entirely speculation unless someone has some recent, authentic, meaningful docs.

But as far as the Bulgravian Boogey, I have to wonder about that too. It seems that DM without the CofS is like a turtle without it's shell. And this is speculation too but I have to wonder if he would ever feel safe enough to leave the protections of his currently or formerly Billion Dollar Cult. For DM I think that would be like moving to Mars. It's not like he has experience in the real world.

Just a theory but I really have to wonder if he could actually leave by his own will.

I think that by this point, DM is addicted to the power. He screams and people jump, cower, and grovel. He doesn't even need to scream -- one disapproving look and the target of his look gets a physical beat down by people desperate to curry favor.

Can you imagine him living in the real world? Where even hired servants would not put up with the kind of abuse he's used to dishing out?

He has lived his whole adult life as somebody with power. It has to have irreparably warped him by now.

 

[Enthetan]

True. But if he can direct its disposition unhindered it's a distinction without a difference.

Paul

Very true. For example, technically, the Pope in the Vatican does not personally own anything, not even the clothes he wears.

 

[Sindy]

True. But if he can direct its disposition unhindered it's a distinction without a difference.

Paul

Why of course, but, he can't.

The one thing he can't do is just walk off with it.

 

[Enthetan]

When I read that the surveillance on Pat Broeker had ceased, my first thought was that the war chest had been seriously depleted. This is discouraging news.

If the war chest has not been depleted, what is your take on the cessation of surveillance on Pat Broeker?

It might alternately mean that nothing that Pat knew as of when he left, has any importance in present time. That the accounts have had their money moved out to other accounts, and from there to other places and the trail scrubbed to the point where nobody could prove anything.

 

[Dulloldfart]

Why of course, but, he can't.

The one thing he can't do is just walk off with it.

You're right. He can't walk off with a billion in his pocket. But a few million here, a few million there . . . .

Paul

 

[Enthetan]

Why of course, but, he can't.

The one thing he can't do is just walk off with it.

Why can't he?

Note that my question is not about whether it is legal for him to, but whether he can do it with low expectation of being subject to punishment. Once the money is scattered among various tax havens, there's not much that governments would be able to do.

 

[RolandRB]

You're right. He can't walk off with a billion in his pocket. But a few million here, a few million there . . . .

Paul

He can move it around including back into the US where it can get lost in the system and appear in his pocket by some miracle.

 

[RolandRB]

It might alternately mean that nothing that Pat knew as of when he left, has any importance in present time. That the accounts have had their money moved out to other accounts, and from there to other places and the trail scrubbed to the point where nobody could prove anything.

He can launder it through the UK and disappear the money there. None of the authorities are going to do anything. Same as they did nothing in this case:

http://www.xenu-directory.net/opinions/rashleighberry19971213.html

$100M - poof - gone! Authorites told. Authorities did nothing.

 

[Enthetan]

You're right. He can't walk off with a billion in his pocket. But a few million here, a few million there . . . .

Paul

There's lots of shell games that can be played with the money. For example, have the Church pay huge bills for legal and investigative services, to firms which are just shell corporations secretly owned or controlled by DM.