ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at www.exscn2.net.



Is there any good in Scientology?

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by Wedinn, Dec 28, 2018.

Tags:
View Users: View Users
  1. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    Celtics?

    I was born in North Conway NH and after my parents' bloody divorce I lived with my father's parents until my mother and stepfather took me down to Taxachusetts. He was an Okinawa vet Marine Dartmouth engineer. His father was a Harvard Med School GP who lived in Reading. It was 1957 the same year Bill Russel came to Baahstin and bought a home in Reading next door to Dr. Baisley. I was then innocent of the stars...

    I'm known as "Bird"

    After my own tragically bloody divorce in 1980, as you may recall, Celtics fans then received an object lesson in just what "Bird" is all about...


    I was a Celts fan and a Bruins fan when I was a kid but I'm all about Sox and Pats since I grew up - Ooo-ooo! I had Red Auerbach in my taxi in the 90's. It was a radio call to 780 Boylston apt. 17K, the apartments at the Pru. I pulled in and the concierge told me my fare would soon appear. He was tall, about 6' 2" and spoke in a gravelly voice telling me we would pick up his friend around the corner then stop in the north end for some lobster on the way to Logan. This guy had the kind of gravitas usually reserved for mafia dons and that was my make on my passenger; a guy who could have someone push the button on me and five minutes later forget I ever was. We picked up his pal and shooting up Stuart I heard them talking about Tommy Heinsohn and I checked my review and recognized the fellow of whom it was said "He was playing chess when all the others were playing checkers."


    But I'm not really hooked into roundball these days though you might cross pollinate some of my "dimensional Kreemo" if you buy my book off Amazon; "The Amendment; Revised, Corrected and Refined" $6.00. I believe it's value to be augured by the recent Red Sox season...
     
  2. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    [​IMG]

    Most helpful customer reviews on Amazon.com
    Amazon.com: 5.0 out of 5 stars 1 reviews
    Amazon Customer
    5.0 out of 5 stars

    Wonderful prose, a steady handed argument.

    3 August 2017 - Published on Amazon.com
    Verified Purchase

    Mr Birdwood presents a clear, rational case. The writing style is a joy to read. This man has some skills!
     
    This is NOT OK !!!! likes this.
  3. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

    I think it's all hypothetical and no one really knows who they are.
     
  4. PirateAndBum

    PirateAndBum Gold Meritorious Patron

    I believe he was referring to Alan Walter and Roger B. Alan is dead (and was quite active on ESMB before he died) and Roger is quite alive and posts often.

    Alan definitely contributed some major bits to Scn, such as use of a "correction list" and good/bad indicators.
     
  5. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

    Is there any good in Scientology?

    There sure is!
    It's the door that hits one in the ass on his or her way out!
    Quite a nice little love tap that reminds you that you're done with all the bullshit for at least that day.
     
  6. This is NOT OK !!!!

    This is NOT OK !!!! Gold Meritorious Patron

    Done sir!

    It will be in my mailbox in 2 days.

    Re Celts....Gordon Hayward had 36 points last night on 14 of 17 shooting. You sure you didn't have something to do with that?
     
  7. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    A fellow New Hampshireman and professing christian is always welcome to draw on my je'n sais quoi so perhaps I did.

    A big chunk of my cosmic juju is derived and developed by my studies of Hubbard's work but LSD does enhance "psychedelic"; mind/soul manifesting phenomena and always the primary cookbook is our judeochristian scripture
     
  8. looker

    looker Patron Meritorious

    Yes, IMHO the lower intro stuff is valuable. TRs, Study Tech and Life Repair.

    Funny, I was part of a discussion with Panda OT8 and another OT8 (Mystic) from years ago.

    Panda said He was glad he did the whole bridge from bottom to top, but the lower levels were most lasting. He said the lower 10% of Scientology was worth while.
    Panda said he had boxes and boxes of his case files, but if he was to look at just stuff he wanted fixed it would only be about 2 folders. The rest of the folders were 2D sits, correction lists, sec checks and stuff that was all temporary gains. He said he wouldn't recommend the whole bridge to a new person just wanting a life tune up.

    Mystic said the reason he left in 84 was it became a job as an auditor and Scientology through OT8 was about the body. His search was for Spirit. Mystic said the meter would read on almost anything, curiosity or real stuff. If you suggest looking for a one eyed purple people eater or a fart glued to a rainbow, the mind would create it along with a meter read. So yes the meter reads on suggested space cooties because the mind will invent it.

    Regarding the Levels Power through OT8.... The discussion was; anything Power and up was a violation of the Auditors Code, in that An auditor should only run what the PC originates he is interested in running. What that means is; Absent the Space Opera in A History of Man or "What To Audit" Its highly unlikely a PC would originate wanting to run space cooties of OT levels. The OT levels were Ron's paranoid case, not everyone's case. And, CLEAR was just a wish list. CLEAR and OT were to keep the money inflowing.

    The TRs was basically Vipassana Buddhism meditation brought to LRH Jr by William B Mayer's nephew. Yes Mayer the MGM Movie Mogul. Vipassana meditation was used as a presence drill so book one auditors would not react or freak out while auditing a Dianetic PC. LRH Jr expanded it to TRs 1-4 then later 5-8.

    The Study Tech Came from Mr and Mrs Bern. 2 English professors who spent 4 years in research shared it with hubbard at St Hill and hubbard stole it. and elaborated it and demanded everyone take the course.

    Life Repair was basically a bunch of word clearing of Scientology terms and actions. Then a meter assessed PC originated, "wants handled" list. Then you run modified correction lists for upsets ARC breaks and 2 way comm on the list then re assess. Then, run an upset Assessment of the 8 dynamics. Then run some OpPro By dup and 8C. Very fun to do. Took about 25 hrs.

    The levels were collections of processes developed at St Hill by the research group. About 100 people from all over the world. The Z unit would audit the processes and debug them. Mystic was at the Founding Church District of Columbia in the 60s when LRH told him to organize all the processes into levels of gradiation to be delivered to the public to make money. Level 0 was communication, Level 1 was Help or Problems er something I forget. Anyway it was to fine tune people and get rid of general baggage.

    Scientology could have been a nice little self help cottage industry if just left at the lower levels. And, of course, leave out the space opera, occult ramblings, and high pressure Reging.
     
    Last edited: Jan 4, 2019
    ThetanExterior and Clay Pigeon like this.
  9. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    I disagree. The TRs are about control, not communication. A practicing Scientologist who strictly applied TRs would not be pleasant to talk to.

    However, I did greatly enjoy "hard" TR 0. Once I "mastered" TR 0, for me it was just like meditation - 2 hours was a pleasure. But I don't see how the kind of control created by the TRs is actually "valuable" in the real world. It really isn't.

    As for "Hubbard Study Tech", it takes some good ideas and carries them way, way, way too far. "Looking up words you don't understand" isn't "Hubbard Study Tech" and that is valuable but pretty common advice for any studying. The rest of the "Hubbard Study Tech" creates a nightmare. Word chains are stupid. "The problem is always you and never the materials" is downright evil. "Demo kit everything?" Really?

    Life Repair, I don't know anything about.
     
  10. TomKat

    TomKat Patron Meritorious

    John McMaster said Hubbard had screamed at the Apollo crew "the bastards have betrayed me!" and slammed his fist down, breaking his arm. The same broken arm he implied was the result of going through the wall of fire.
     
    looker likes this.
  11. pineapple

    pineapple Silver Meritorious Patron

    Are you thinking of Richard de Mille, maybe?
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Richard_de_Mille#Writing_career
    That was Charles and Ava Berner.
    http://www.forum.exscn.net/threads/...e-you’ve-been-looking-for.48285/#post-1179321
     
    guanoloco likes this.
  12. pineapple

    pineapple Silver Meritorious Patron

    It was his back Hubbard claimed he'd broken, not his arm.

    Where did McMaster say this?
     
  13. TomKat

    TomKat Patron Meritorious

    I'd have to listen to Ron's Journal 68 to be sure, but I'm pretty sure it was the arm. I think the supposed broken back was coming out of the Navy.

    I heard him say it in my living room.
     
  14. pineapple

    pineapple Silver Meritorious Patron

    I stand partially corrected. It was the back AND the arm, as well as a knee. I only remembered the back.

    "It is quite aside from the point, but maybe a slight matter of interest, that all of this recent career has been relatively hard on this poor body. I have broken its back, broken its knee, and now have a broken arm because of the strenuousness of these particular adventures."
    http://suppressiveperson.org/1967/09/20/transcript-rons-journal-67/

    I assumed this was all more of Hubbard's bullshit, though, like his war injuries. You heard McMaster say he actually did break his arm?
     
  15. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    "It is quite aside from the point, but maybe a slight matter of interest, that all of this recent career has been relatively hard on this poor body. I have broken its back, broken its knee, and now have a broken arm because of the strenuousness of these particular adventures. One wonders, then, well, if he is in such good shape, then what is he doing breaking up these bodies? Well, that is the trouble! I have — I have a great difficulty in getting down to the small power level of a body and if suddenly – if something happens in its vicinity – I will suddenly move it or yank it in some direction, and it is very very difficult to keep it in any kind of condition. I’m keeping it alive because it is a symbol and because it is still needful and because it would be upsetting, at least to the wog side of the world, if a symbol of this body were to disappear."

    Partial Transcript of RJ67.

    ETA: That'll teach me to go and feed me pet crow half way through writing this post and letting pineapple get there first. Doh!
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  16. TomKat

    TomKat Patron Meritorious

    LRH was talking about his history of broken bones, the most recent being the arm.

    Yes, John said LRH broke his arm slamming it down on something. He was upset because his crew could not dock the ship, while another ship docked quickly and effortlessly while the Apollo crew fumbled every attempt. "The bastards have betrayed me!"
     
  17. TomKat

    TomKat Patron Meritorious

    Well, it is tough being the antichrist, and even he had to dispense with it for research purposes :)
     
  18. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    Yeah, and not a moment too soon IMO.
     
  19. F.Bullbait

    F.Bullbait Oh, a wise guy,eh?

    There was a tape played for staff of LRH announcing OT8 in the late 70's.

    (That was when that level was supposed to give you total control of the MEST universe.)

    He mentioned he had broken his back 3 times, if I recall correctly.

    Update: Sorry it should be 'total cause over the MEST universe'. 'Control' is too low toned.;)
     
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2019
  20. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

    Plus you remember that he wiped out his Harley and came back looking for someone to blame for that. He might have realized later, the way it often works with back injuries, that he broke his back. Might have been a vertebrae and he thought it would sound better to say it happened during upper level research because otherwise people would think "wow, has Ron gone PTS?"