ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

Is there any good in Scientology?

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by Wedinn, Dec 28, 2018.

  1. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    CP, you are way behind with your drug information.

    Recently, I cared for an older woman who had hallucinations, heard voices, etc. and was stark raving mad, absolutely psychotic. She ate healthy foods and took supplements, so it wasn't that. This woman couldn't focus long enough to finish any one simple thing, and she yelled and screamed a lot. No brain damage, though, no dementia. She had all the tests. Everyone tried counseling her, too. She was miserable and made everyone around her miserable, too.

    She was put on risperidone (Risperdol). Wow, what a difference. She's so THERE now, focused, doesn't yell and scream as much and she sleeps soundly at night, too. She even has her sense of humor and creativity back. The only side-effect has been occasional dry mouth.

    Risperdol is one of the second generation anti-psychotics and it's not even habit-forming. It's nothing like Lithium. It's not the old days anymore and this drug is saving this woman's life and sanity. Good for her.
  2. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    Good news and a first-hand account

    Not to be picayune but that's more like third or fourth generation anti-psychotic drug
  3. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    Bill, I have never called Hubbard the most important or influential genius ever. I am certainly one of his critics but I am not one of his enemies. And I read closely the whole spectrum of writing on hubbard and his work
  4. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    Thanks, CP. :)
    Yes, it was good to see for myself.

    They call it a second-generation anti-psychotic. I have no idea how they decide that.

    There is still a risk of TD though, but much, much lower than Lithium. It varies, but the highest risk rate reported for the second gen anti-psychotics is 11% of those medicated (It's 5.3% in other studies) There is no risk difference by age, but there is a big difference in risk according to how high the dose is. This woman is on the lowest possible dose and it's working. Her doctor sincerely cares.

    Also, she is elderly, so at this rate, even if she were in the unfortunate small percent that develop TD (Tardive Dyskinesia), it is unlikely she will develop TD before something else physical breaks down. I think the doctor made a wise choice. It gave her life back. She was in a personal hell before the med, just in constant blind rage and paranoid besides and too afraid to even sleep. Nobody should ever have to live like that.
    Clay Pigeon likes this.
  5. Bill

    Bill Gold Meritorious Patron

    Hmmm. Let's see what I can find...
    Here's one after a short search:
    I see that there is no good way to search. It's too much work to locate all the times you've gushed over Hubbard's "genius" and "influence" and "lasting impact" -- on and on.

    You have shown, time after time, that you cannot, will not admit the evil that is built into Scientology. You have shown an amazingly locked mind when it comes to seeing what is intrinsically wrong with Hubbard's "tech". Not my problem.
    strativarius likes this.
  6. Little David

    Little David Gold Meritorious Patron

    Not that important but, the tablets are stainless steel, one of the cases they are in are titanium.




    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
  7. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    Thank you so much for correcting me LD.

    Actually I've paid very little attention to the details of all this because frankly my dear, I don't give a fuck.
    Clay Pigeon likes this.
  8. guanoloco

    guanoloco As-Wased

    ESMB's strativarius...

  9. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    Oh god, I hope I've never looked as slimy and slippery as that. You got the movie right tho'.
  10. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    So funny how greased up hair used to be the thing for men back then. Yuck! :puke:

    Women had their hair up then, then in the 70s it was straight hair, then in the 80s, big, poofy hair.

    Cher in the 70s and 80s:

  11. guanoloco

    guanoloco As-Wased

    Cher's pretty pissed about that wall nowadays.
  12. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    Yeh, but who listens to Cher or ever did? She was so mean to Sonny on some of the Sonny & Cher shows and it wasn't all an act, either. No wonder he joined a cult. She must have drove him nuts.
  13. DagwoodGum

    DagwoodGum Squirreling Dervish

    HA! I used to get tortured when I first started working for the county here doing drawbridge repair & maintenance. They all knew that I HATED CHER!!!!! Well, not so much hate but it just irritated me to no end to hear her haughty voice whenever one of her songs came on the radio back in the late 90's that the guys would sometimes crank it up when she would come on just to get my goat. I could never imagine why people found her so beautiful?
    She got popular from hanging out at the famous Phil Specter "wall of sound" studio with "the wrecking crew" when she was still a nobody and they'd let her sing background on songs for other artists just because she was always there and could be used with a moments notice.
    That famous bass player Carol Kaye in the wrecking crew came up with the famous bass line in the beat goes on because the one that Sonny wrote was shit! The song became a classic because of it.
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2019
    TheOriginalBigBlue likes this.
  14. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    I do stand by the statement "Hubbard was a philosopher and genius of magnitude"

    I don't worship Thomas Jefferson, George Washington Carver, George Smith Patton, Tom Brady, Sully or R. Crumb. I don't even worship Alfred E. Neuman and all of these to me are less flawed in personal character than L. Ron Hubbard.

    The sonofabitch was still a fukkin' genius

    I have also repeatedly mentioned that even while I studied and later served on staff that I had reservations about inherent and potential in Hubbard's work.



    I'm here. Not there.
    Last edited: Jan 14, 2019
  15. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    I don't know if you got the memo CP, but LRH told Sarge he failed. And he wasn't coming back.
  16. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    here's the memo:

  17. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    I got that message Gibby.

    I don't know exactly what he meant in saying that he failed. He apparently wanted to be some sort of planetary El Primo Maximo and he wanted to produce "Homo Novis" with extraordinary capabilities. One of his students, Leonard Cohen came up with words which might have been inspired by him and seem to fit him; "he was starving in some deep mystery like a man who is sure what is true" and "he was looking for that card so high and wild he'd never need to deal another"

    It was good to hear he said that. It reeks of sanity. I remain among those who are both impressed by and grateful for the man's many successes. The materials which are not confidential available, back then, at CLIV orgs contain astonishing insight into the mind and spirit which in the hands of men and women of good will, and I would add most particularly those who bind themselves to judeochristian sensibilities, have great practical value.


    Very pleasant to have you on speaking terms with me Gib.
  18. HelluvaHoax!

    HelluvaHoax! Platinum Meritorious Sponsor with bells on

    Agreed. I was particularly impressed with Ron's greatest success--traveling to Target II.

    That win was beyond my wildest dreams! After I heard that Ron went into deep space after having killed his body, I was off auditing for quite an extended time on a persistent F/N.
  19. Clay Pigeon

    Clay Pigeon Gold Meritorious Patron

    Behave yourself Hoaxie or I'll get Immigration Services to deport you back to Helatrobus
  20. strativarius

    strativarius Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband

    Cohen's probably turning over in his grave hearing you attribute his words to that shyster Hubbard. 'Stranger Song' was recorded in 1967 and probably conceived a lot earlier whereas he never got involved with scn. until 68/9.