ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

Knowing How to Know vs. Believing

Discussion in 'Evaluating and Criticising Scientology' started by Mojo, Oct 13, 2007.

View Users: View Users
  1. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    Yes, we are on the same wave-length here.

    It doesn't bother me if LRH blocked it, or somebody else blocked it back when. What is important is to discover for oneself who or what is blocking it in the present.

    AXIOM 1 is just fine when looked at from the Vedic viewpoint. But you may explain how it is the "basic incorrectness of Scio" from your viewpoint.

  2. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    I'm not sure if you can truly get the purity or infiniteness of the formless unsubstantial substance of the purity and essence of Spirit or the purity and essence or infiniteness of pure conciousness, awareness, love etc. (fill in the formless unsubstantial substance qualities and attributes of your choice.)
  3. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    Who knows? These are just considerations.

  4. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    Vinaire -

    Are you aware of the thought-stopping techniques you employ?

    "These are just considerations"

    "You are just emoting"


    You are using filters to discredit the idea in your own mind so that no more thought occurs in that area.

    Are you aware of this?
  5. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    I have a lot of problems with 'Axiom 1', including the fact that it's called an 'Axiom' in the first place. Then, there comes the generalization re: 'Life' and on and on.

    But, more than anything else, what really bugs me about it is the use of the weasle-word 'basically' in it. If you're trying to make some kind of *core*, absolute and essentially 'basic' statement, *why* dilute it by saying 'basically', which just begs the question; 'OK, it's *basically* that; what is it *unbasically*??'

  6. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    Hope he heeds what you have indicated Alanzo! :)
  7. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Good point Zinj.
    It always seemed to me a bit of a woolly definition for an axiom.
    I think Hubbard didn't like to put out anything that suggested he didn't have a complete understanding and mastery concerning that of which he wrote.

    It wouldn't be too hard to define static first and then say that all life derived from static. Even "life" is woolly in axiom 1, as it usually means theta + mest in biological forms.
  8. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    You forgot about, "This is infinitization," "Duh," and several others indicating emotional outbursts.

    "These are just considerations," was a response to the following invalidative opinion or speculation that was not beneficial to dwell upon. It is just gobbledygook.

    How would you respond to such an opinion if directed at you?

  9. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    "Axiom 1" has clarified to me the understanding of Brahma as I explored it on the thread THE VEDIC VIEWPOINT.

  10. nexus100

    nexus100 Gold Meritorious Patron


    "Oh yeah? So's your old man!"
  11. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor


  12. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    Alanzo, you may note that Alan didn't respond to a direct request to explain how Axiom 1 is the "basic incorrectness of Scio."

    This is quite a serious point.

  13. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    Is this kinda like a KR? And you want the EO to handle?

    Please provide more specifics, then.


    Alanzos secretary (or nosy board member)
  14. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Is that your Maggie Gyllenhal to his James Spader? :D
  15. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    Maybe Moneypenny to Bond; James Bond

  16. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Do you mean that she's tied to a desk working and he occasionally pops his head around the door for a 2 minute flirt but then goes off and shags every other woman in Christendom? :)
  17. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    What is "MI"? Mission Impossible?

  18. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    VERY FUNNY!!! HA HA.:duh:
  19. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    Its Ml - an l - the letter "el".

    It means "much love":D
  20. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    But the great thing about that is he has no idea where I am the rest of the day neither....:whistling: