ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at www.exscn2.net.



"Most Scientologists are Christians"

Discussion in 'Scientology Front Groups and Alliances' started by Veda, Sep 20, 2019.

View Users: View Users
  1. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    [​IMG]
    Scientology Training Routine for Lying a.k.a. TR-L

    ________________




    See 9:22 - 10:20 to witness public TR-L (Training Routine Lie).​


    With Scientologists dominating the Clearwater, Florida Downtown Development Board, it's fair, at this point, to describe the Board as a Scientology front group, if not an overt Scientology advocacy group.

    But not completely overt - there's still an element of disguise.

    Recently, in response to Mark Bunker, at a recent hearing, Downtown Development Board member, and OT 8, Ray Cassano, stated, "I am a Scientologist, also a Christian. Most Scientologists are Christians."

    Not to be left out, our own Alanzo just today chimed in, asserting that "Many Scientologists... are actually Christians..."

    From the 1952 book 'Scientology 8-8008', one of Scientology's "basic books':

    "The concept of infinite mind is not new, but it has always been assigned to another beingness than self. The preclear will be found to be intensely aberrated who has sworn allegiance to some infinite beingness... Infinite mind is individualistic... It was beyond the power and the grasp of the intellect applying itself to the field of philosophy, to conceive a multiplicity of infinite minds..."

    Aleister Crowley, who Hubbard discussed with respect and affection during his Philadelphia Doctorate Course lectures of 1952, also was a proponent of the idea of a multiplicity of Infinite Minds.

    [​IMG]
    Self portrait


    Last time I looked, both the book 'Scientology 8-8008' and the 'PDC' lectures are readily available to all Scientologists. They are not confidential.

    Scientology has tested the big lie that Scientology is friendly towards Christianity and, over the years, some Scientologists have deceived others by spreading vague generalities about how Scientology is compatible with Christianity, etc.; and a handy way for a Scientologist to shut down any "wog" criticism has always been to present the outrageous whopper of "I am a Christian."

    But this is new.

    With the assertion that "most" or "many Scientologists are Christians," we are in new territory.

    TR-L has gone from being a (covert) Intelligence action to being an (in your face) PR action.
     
    pineapple, Type4_PTS and Lurker5 like this.
  2. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

  3. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    Curious as to whether there's a recent internal directive from Miscavige, re. using the "Christian angle" to a greater extent than previously. Usually, when Miscavige says "jump," Scientologists and their helpers can be seen jumping - parroting same words.


    ______________
    A Scientologist in a Christian minister costume


    [​IMG]

    ____________________
    Some background

    Puff ball interviews of "celebrity" Scientologists - who have been coached by cult PRs - are nothing new. For example, these, below, are from some years ago.

    In the first interview the Christian angle is used.


    DENYING THAT SCIENTOLOGY IS A SPACE ALIEN CULT...


    Scientology celebrity Juliette Lewis (born 1973) did a 2010 interview with Vanity Fair magazine. Lewis was asked about Xenu, space aliens, etc., and she lied.

    She explained that some people are confusing Hubbard's science fiction works with his other studies.

    The actual interview it is located here:
    http://www.vanityfair.com/online/oscars/2010/12/juliette-lewis.html

    __________​

    Interviewer's questions in bold black. Scientologist's answers in red:

    I’m not sure how to segue into this, so I’ll just come out and ask. You’re a Scientologist, right?

    I am, yeah.

    Do you celebrate Christmas? I’ve never been sure about that. Does Christmas count as a Scientology holiday?

    Oh yeah. We absolutely celebrate Christmas.

    So you have a tree with ornaments and eggnog and presents and Christmas carols that aren't about Xenu?

    I’m a Christian! [Beautifully done instant change of subject. Great 'Reporter TRs']. I think there’s so much confusion because people don’t understand a religion...

    It’s about understanding one’s self and others and compassion and how to communicate better and how to live in this troubled society. It’s really basic, common sense stuff. It has nothing to do with all this funny folklore that surrounds it...

    Do you believe your ancestors were reincarnated aliens?

    That’s not been a part of my experience, no. (Laughs.)

    So... you don’t believe you came from aliens?

    I was thinking about where that idea came from, and I was like, 'Oh, maybe it’s because [L. Ron] Hubbard was a successful science fiction writer, so they’re confusing his science fiction with his other studies that have nothing to do with science fiction...'

    ...The one thing that troubles me is when rumor becomes hatred and prejudice towards a group of people. That’s when it becomes scary, when you have people trying to take away other people’s right to practice a religion of your own choosing...


    ___________

    Not directly related to the topic at hand - the Christian angle - but included anyway.


    Another example of Scientologists lying for Scientology:

    Jump ahead to 3:55 in this interview of Scientology Celebrity, and Scientologist her entire life, Kate Caberano (born 1966), and her husband. The subject of Christmas didn't come up, but there was a question about "aliens." Compare the answer to JL's answer. This is pat PR.

    Interviewer: People will say, 'Do you believe in aliens?'

    Kate Caberano: I've never heard of it in all my three generations.

    Kate Caberano's husband: I think people confuse L. Ron Hubbard's science fiction work with his philosophical and religious work.



    __________


    Playing the "bigotry and hate" card.
     
    Last edited: Sep 21, 2019
  4. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

  5. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Scientology promo often says: "All denominations welcome".

    The real question is: "Welcome to what?"

    Answer: A progressive indoctrination into KSW fanaticism that demands any other practices be abandoned or relegated to second place for PR purposes.

    http://www.gerryarmstrong.org/50grand/cult/ksw1-2.html

    ksw1-2.gif
     
    Veda and Type4_PTS like this.
  6. Type4_PTS

    Type4_PTS Diamond Invictus SP

    Welcome to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars (and years of their lives) to find out their prior religious beliefs are the result of an implant millions of years ago (compliments of Xenu). It's OK though because once they come to their senses they'll realize that Scientology is the only path to salvation.
     
    UTR, TheOriginalBigBlue, Veda and 2 others like this.
  7. TheOriginalBigBlue

    TheOriginalBigBlue Gold Meritorious Patron

    Exactly. Mike did an excellent summary of the issue here...

    https://www.mikerindersblog.org/can-scientologists-be-christians-or-jews-too/
     
    Lurker5 and Type4_PTS like this.
  8. Xenu Xenu Xenu

    Xenu Xenu Xenu Patron Meritorious

    I knew a Scientologist who claimed to be a Christian. He was a rabid gung-ho Scientologist, that much I was sure of. He claimed to be at the crucifixion of Christ in one of his many past lives. By the time he became an OT, he was still claiming to be Christian. By that I mean he spent all his time on Scientology and never wasted his time on going to a Christian church but in his heart he still believed in the concept of "being a nice person who does not engage in cruelty", which is what most religions preach, not only Christianity. I am pretty sure he at least thought the "idea" of Jesus Christ was a good thing even though Ron Hubbard said it was all an implant. Before Scientology he was studying theology and divinity courses at university. He wanted to be a minister and I mean a real minister not some bullshit Scientology minister.

    How is this even possible? Well, nothing surprises me these days when it comes to Scientologists. You would think he would have left the cult after what he learnt what Hubbard wrote about Christ. You would think. Obviously, Scientology was the most important thing in his life, edging out even his Christian upbringing and beliefs.

    What I think is that somehow or another he managed to "find a way" to fit all these contradicting ideas in that brainwashed mind of his. As crazy as that sounds I know humans are capable of such things.

    As for the rest of those clams who claim to be Christians, well, I don't know them but I suspect more than a few are bald faced liars.
     
    Lurker5 likes this.
  9. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

    Didn't the Christ implant stuff show up in OTVIII - and only for a short period of time, and was removed when it caused a bit of upset, so that many don't even KNOW about that implant thing? Is that right? Or did I make that up in my head? Even so, yeah, scio/co$ wipes out everything on other religions - eventually. Which is why I am so surprised by Nation of Islam endorsing scn/co$. Who can figure.

    Oh, I am not an ex - so I may not have complete understanding or knowledge of any of this - I am asking . . . .
     
  10. Xenu Xenu Xenu

    Xenu Xenu Xenu Patron Meritorious

    I am not sure either. Shows you how much I really give a shit about the "tech" of Scientology. LOL! I could be very wrong about it. But I do know this guy really believed he was both a clam and a Christian and he was an OT. Some of those clams lie but this guy was sincere as well as OT.
     
  11. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    Well, that's one.

    There's always one here or there. Usually, privately, they're regarded as Degraded Beings.

    When he does "New OT 8" and realizes that the mental image picture he had of himself, at the crucifixion, belongs to a "BT," wonder what he'll do?
     
  12. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

    Oh wait, maybe the implant thing is still there @Xenu Xenu Xenu and it is lrh claiming to be the anti-christ that was quickly deleted . . ?

    Anyone ? Anyone? Bueller? Ferris Bueller?

    And if it is in OT8, then the rank and file wouldn't even know about it until hundreds of thousands of dollars, if they even make it that far.
     
  13. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    You're thinking of the 1980 OT VIII HCOB. Hubbard stated that he was in the role of Lucifer and his influence was preventing the second coming, which was the return of the extraterrestrial Markabians. That confidential HCOB was theory without practical, and did not coincide with the OT 8 thrown together by then Senior C/S Ray Mithoff, so it was tossed.

    Religious implants were first mentioned by Hubbard in his lectures during 1952.
     
  14. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

    @Veda - where and when was the part about Christ being a pedophile? Was Homosexual in there too?

    I think the one true thing lrh ever said was that he was in the role of Lucifer - and it had to be tossed :lol:

    What a 'religion' .
     
  15. Veda

    Veda Sponsor

    He didn't say he was Lucifer, only in the role of Lucifer, which means "light bringer."

    The Bible, Christ, and just about everything, was the result of "implants" that are being "dramatized" here on Earth.

    Jesus - not Christ who, according to Hubbard, didn't exist - was described as a lover of young boys, but I don't want to look it up. It's easy to find with a search on OT VIII HCOB.
     
  16. Lurker5

    Lurker5 Gold Meritorious Patron

    That is good enough for me @Veda. Thanks for the clarifications. :cool: