Ot III and beyond sources plagiarized from

Discussion in 'Scientology Technology' started by mockingbird, Mar 9, 2015.

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  1. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    It's a paperweight. Not an overly pretty one....sigh.

    (I could not tell at first if that was a giraffe swirling down or someone's arm waving above the swirl.)
  2. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    It's me and my ability to follow what you wrote going down the drain in a whirlpool of confusion. Mimsey
  3. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    I won't try to reexplain it as I am not sure if I'd make it worse. I could paint the paperweight blue and see if that might cover over the majority of the ugly bumpy parts.

  4. Leland

    Leland Crusader

    I disagree with you post Maria at #438.

    To me....this is could somewhat be "falling into the Abyss..." and falling off the "bridge" from the physical plane to the spiritual plane.....and "dying" as an individual...

    And I am NOT using "bridge" here as a Cult term....but just as an English word...
  5. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    He always said he searched a sea of data looking for the few drops that were workable. Or was it grains of sand? This could be yet another example of that culling process he did, taping a path out of the sticky darkness, to keep us from wandering off to look at pretty flowers that lead no where. Good point the above. Mimsey
  6. Leland

    Leland Crusader

    Yes.....thanks for reminding me of that .....a well known quote of Hubbard's. A well grooved in constant mental reminder in the Cult materials...."to keep" on the narrow path of the Cult of Hubbard.

    He told us what he was doing.


    I suppose the proof is "in the pudding."
  7. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    No - don't. There's so much you said that you have studied that I haven't. I was just astounded by it, and responded by trying to be funny. Like this:


  8. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    There are two academic videos that grad students pass around, just for their mental health. Since it seems that to understand 1 thing requires understanding 10 more and then each of those 10....on into infinity. And also that there is something unchanging or meaningless or both about philosophy....or knowledge.

    I was just trying to say that that problem of how to bring science and religion together (New Thought is an example of that) has been going on since before the 1600s.

    And that the problem of consciousness as "the highest goal and value" began after science became a new 'god' and replaced the old paradigms of the middle ages. So there was a loss of that unity of knowledge and theology after the 1500s. Consciousness seemed to replace the soul and became 'the' thing.

    And knowledge was divided into branches and disciplines.

    To report my own bias, I am not that interested in consciousness, more so in the soul. So if the I is consciousness, I will go with soul and skip the I. And if the I is the soul then I am down for it.
  9. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    Here is one of the videos I mentioned.
  10. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    the graduate student realizes quicksand is for real.
  11. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    So a question about F/Ns would be what is the f/n measuring, consciousness? electrical? the thetan? the soul?

    Usually when we use a scientific device to examine something, it's clear what the something to be measured is.

    Now I don't know what the e-meter measures. Nothing it seems. Sweat?

  12. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    I am with you there - I think the soul has consciousness or awareness as an integral component. I was reading the three books by Robert Monroe ( Far Journeys, Journeys out of the body, and Ultimate Journey ) which relate his many out of body experiences, and exploration of the near universe and other planes of existence - and he has an interesting version of the soul.

    I am paraphrasing: The soul came to this planet, and to some extent, to learn while in sort of a fantasy land of earthly / bodily experiences. Each life lived here sort of takes on a life of it's own, and there's sort of a repository one has of his previous incarnations. Almost like having multiple personalities that are live extensions of the basic being, each with it's own viewpoint or facet of the whole. Each being capable of communication, thought etc. If I followed what he said correctly: at the end of the learning experience / lives / journey and the being no longer needs to experience life on this planet they re-integrate into a new whole. Or something like that.

    He has cds you can purchase that you listen to that help you go exterior. I started listening to them, but got side tracked, and should finish them.

  13. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    Ask the real Scientologist has a couple great posts about just that. I think he answers it rather well.



    He has many interesting posts at his site. Off and on I see him post on ESMB I think as Just Bill


  14. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    The links are excellent. I like where he writes that the meter cannot tell truth from lie. and it is not perfect, it can be fooled.
  15. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    Yeah - I like those a lot. Hubbard likes to say it reads just below the level of awareness but that doesn't explain the dating drills where the coach knows the date. LOL. I remember doing the drill on a person at flag who read like a shot - she was so frustrated because the sups kept pulling her off her checksheet to hold the cans for people to pass their drills on. After a few times doing the drill with her I stopped and used other coaches because she was too easy. She was not squeezing the cans or anything like that at all. I felt I wasn't learning anything.

    Oh and can it ever be fooled - I FSMed a guy and he simply thought happy thoughts and the needle f/ned whenever they asked him something he didn't want to answer. He was doing that a few weeks after being on lines. I wish I had thought of that - especially after pissing away so much money on sec checks at Flag.

  16. Maria Cuervo

    Maria Cuervo Gold Meritorious Patron

    I agree. I had pcs that did that too.
    I find that skipping e-meters and just talking to people is a better way for me to go through life. :biggrin:
  17. beltway

    beltway Bone Idle

    That was my guess, too.

    Some years ago DullOldFart did an experimental video with two buckets of water in which he submerged one hand and one can in each bucket so that the water completed the circuit. The result was fairly similar to directly holding the cans IIRC, so it's probably not measuring sweat.
  18. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Good catch!

    I think it may often read just below the level of awareness.

    There is a well known class VIII ref where Hubbard says [paraphraze]
    " All you know is that the meter read. Maybe there was a fly buzzing around."

    The implication I take as minimally tech trained is that one must explore a bit more.


    You realise that people on the meter course were taking a year on
    meter drills mainly because of this drill.
  19. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    Well let me tell you, you wanna get a date with a girl? Using the meter
    guarantees 100% success.:coolwink:
  20. Mimsey Borogrove

    Mimsey Borogrove Crusader

    I dunno, I know many thought it was a hill too far, and the way they solved it at Flag on the 6 course? Ringers. Wed evening they'd show up, and you'd have 4 or 5 in a row getting dated and passing the students off. Bam, bam, bam. I was coaching Rosser Cole back on the BC at ASHO in the 80's and we had to practically chain him to the chair he was sooooo very frustrated - he would go down a false chain, the reads would die off, go back, find where he went wrong and go forward - he finally got the date. You'd think he'd be happy? Nah. He was pissed we put him through so much hell. But he did it. It really shows off your expertise. It was a date in the millions all the way down to the seconds.