Stabbing @ Scio Sydney - 12/2/2019 9:42 PM Central Time USA
- Thread starter Miss Ellie
- Start date
Leland
Crusader
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/teenager-arrested-stabbing-scientology-headquarters-2019-1
"The church, which claims up to 150,000 Australian followers, describes the Sydney complex on its website as providing “advanced religious services to Scientologists from across Australia, New Zealand and the Asia Pacific region”.
The 2016 Australian census records 1,684 people describing their religion as Scientology."
"The church, which claims up to 150,000 Australian followers, describes the Sydney complex on its website as providing “advanced religious services to Scientologists from across Australia, New Zealand and the Asia Pacific region”.
The 2016 Australian census records 1,684 people describing their religion as Scientology."
oneonewasaracecar
Gold Meritorious Patron
^ I remember. I think you are right on the footbullets coming out of this. If this damages them in Taiwan, ANZO will be hit hard.
oneonewasaracecar
Gold Meritorious Patron
More like 150
ThetanExterior
Gold Meritorious Patron
Those who have never been in Scientology may be wondering how this will be handled at a local level. Well, this is my best guess.
The first thimg to do is handle any negative PR in relation to scientology. Make sure everyone knows the "shore story" and don't let anyone talk to the press unless authorised.
Secondly, deal with the stats. The woman on the Purif will be told that her son was an SP who was trying to get her off the Purif and LRH said that in the face of suppression you need to "flourish and prosper". Therefore she needs to spend more time in the sauna and make sure her stats rise this week. Having one staff member dead and another injured is a nuisance but everyone will have to help to cover their posts until things get back to normal.
Anyone displaying sympathy or compassion will be told that these are low-toned "human emotions and reactions" and they should knock it off. All that has happened is the org has had "a flap", "a hill 10" and it is nothing that can't be handled by the standard application of scientology tech.
Three cheers for LRH.
The first thimg to do is handle any negative PR in relation to scientology. Make sure everyone knows the "shore story" and don't let anyone talk to the press unless authorised.
Secondly, deal with the stats. The woman on the Purif will be told that her son was an SP who was trying to get her off the Purif and LRH said that in the face of suppression you need to "flourish and prosper". Therefore she needs to spend more time in the sauna and make sure her stats rise this week. Having one staff member dead and another injured is a nuisance but everyone will have to help to cover their posts until things get back to normal.
Anyone displaying sympathy or compassion will be told that these are low-toned "human emotions and reactions" and they should knock it off. All that has happened is the org has had "a flap", "a hill 10" and it is nothing that can't be handled by the standard application of scientology tech.
Three cheers for LRH.
Miss Ellie
Miss Ellie
I still have not seen an ID of the victim so they must still be looking to notify his family. If his family is in reaction will be controlled. If his family is not in or if he had disconnected and they talk to the press it will be harder for sciobots to controll.
I am so sorry for his family. I have lost a child there is nothing worse you can experience.
I am so sorry for his family. I have lost a child there is nothing worse you can experience.
Well, I suppose their claim is technically correct: they do indeed have UP TO (i.e., no more than) 150,000 followers. If that is the wording that the Church uses, then it's carefully worded lies. Most organisations would say something like "we have in excess of XXX members", not "up to".
Type4_PTS
Diamond Invictus SP
I have no knowledge of what the situation for Scientology in China is presently. But do know that there was major promotion of Dianetics and Applied Scholastics there back in the late 80's. I was part of a project which sent a dozen scn celebrities over to China for a series of concerts where promotion of Dianetics was occurring.
Hopefully the Chinese government woke up and blocked the emergence of the Scn cult over there.
Leland
Crusader
LOL, good catch. Very tricky wording!
TheOriginalBigBlue
Gold Meritorious Patron
I was curious to see if Taiwan gets the quality of coverage that, for example, the Daily Mail provides. I found this English news site but the article is pretty generic, repeating what the Australian sites have. I did notice some other articles on Scientology problems in Russia and Masterson and of course Cruise but on the whole my impression is that they are not particularly well informed. The negative articles seem almost on par with Scientology's PR releases.
I expect a serious lack of general knowledge about Scientology has been fundamental to their success there but exactly because they push the envelope on very iffy behavior the possibility of something random like this happening is actually a reliable constant. I have to believe that no matter how much damage control they achieve that this will still be very damaging in Taiwan simply by virtue of drawing attention to Scientology.
Apple Daily and Liberty Times are larger Chinese language news sites and I couldn't find anything about this story with site searches.
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3609488
TAIPEI (Taiwan News) – A Taiwanese man died after being stabbed by a teenager at the Asia Pacific headquarters of the Church of Scientology in Sydney, the Australian media reported Thursday.
The teenager was believed to be a member of a Scientologist family who had been asked to leave the premises over a domestic incident the previous day, the Sydney Morning Herald reported.
As the 16-year-old was escorted out of the center, he produced a knife and stabbed a 24-year-old man believed to be a Taiwanese church employee in the neck, the report quoted local police as saying.
(snip)
I expect a serious lack of general knowledge about Scientology has been fundamental to their success there but exactly because they push the envelope on very iffy behavior the possibility of something random like this happening is actually a reliable constant. I have to believe that no matter how much damage control they achieve that this will still be very damaging in Taiwan simply by virtue of drawing attention to Scientology.
Apple Daily and Liberty Times are larger Chinese language news sites and I couldn't find anything about this story with site searches.
https://www.taiwannews.com.tw/en/news/3609488
TAIPEI (Taiwan News) – A Taiwanese man died after being stabbed by a teenager at the Asia Pacific headquarters of the Church of Scientology in Sydney, the Australian media reported Thursday.
The teenager was believed to be a member of a Scientologist family who had been asked to leave the premises over a domestic incident the previous day, the Sydney Morning Herald reported.
As the 16-year-old was escorted out of the center, he produced a knife and stabbed a 24-year-old man believed to be a Taiwanese church employee in the neck, the report quoted local police as saying.
(snip)
dchoiceisalwaysrs
Gold Meritorious Patron
I realize I am very late to this thread but in my opinion OSA has already swayed the Chief Inspector Jones off of believing the incident did not have to do with the Scientology premises and the activities going on there PRIOR to the knife murder engram.... the Chief I hope realizes eventually that there is definitely an earlier beginning at the scientology premises and that OSA information is a misdirector....Scientology creates trauma and disasters....that is what the Chief needs to look into...
Leland
Crusader
"The boy has now been charged with murder, common assault (DV), common assault, assault occasioning actual bodily harm and affray.
He's been refused bail to appear at Parramatta Children's Court on Saturday."
https://www.bluemountainsgazette.co...en-charged-over-scientology-stabbing/?cs=9397
He's been refused bail to appear at Parramatta Children's Court on Saturday."
https://www.bluemountainsgazette.co...en-charged-over-scientology-stabbing/?cs=9397
dchoiceisalwaysrs
Gold Meritorious Patron
OSA has been feeding fresh baked muffins to the News.
from the post made by Karen#1 " The opening of their sprawling Australasian headquarters two years ago turned Sydney into a Scientology mega-hub and was hailed by the church as a “golden age” for Sydney."
Oh yes....Sydney is now a scientology mega-hub and it is a 'golden age" for Sydney.....ahhhh those muffins are surely called "useful idiot feeders"
That is unfortunately how the News can say that....and how the Chief can be misdirected...
One thing I can say about OSA is that they are very quick on the bullshit.
The_Fixer
Class Clown
Just some notes to our overseas members who would not be aware of Australian things. I live just outside Sydney.
Firstly, because the child is under 18, we may never learn his identity due to child protection laws here and may never even find out family members involved. If the victim is unrelated, his name may be released if it does not identify the child.
The crime will be considered premeditated with intent, since he went from Ryde to Chatswood armed with a deadly weapon. Ryde is not far from Chatswood by the map, but takes a bit of effort to get there. The areas involved can get quite congested. So, plenty of time to reconsider and to dispose of the weapon.
Carrying anything that could be used as a weapon is frowned upon by the law here and heavy penalties can apply. If you have a baseball bat or a tyre iron in the car for protection and the police think this is your intent, expect to be charged. No public are permitted weapons for personal protection from other people over here. If you are at risk of being hurt by, say, an intruder then you can reasonably pick up something handy to defend yourself. If you are in the kitchen and pick up a knife to fend the attacker off, then that is considered a reasonable defence. If you kill him and he was unarmed, then you are in trouble under the use of reasonable force law. You are only really allowed to use a matching or slightly higher level of force your attacker is using. It tends to become a pretty grey area in courts.
We have had a number of cases here where the person defending themselves has ended up killing the aggressor. It isn't pretty for the defendant as the cases often drag out for a long time (sometimes years) and the legal costs are astronomical. Guilty or not, life often gets pretty hard then.
Metal detectors are mainly only used here in airports, courthouses and major official buildings considered to be at risk. They are not in common use or in schools, etc.
Besides that, all factors leading to the incident [bcolor=transparent]will be considered [/bcolor]in court. Being a child (legally), he will not be tried in a open court, or by jury, but will be tried in the children's court by a judge with lawyers present. The hearing will likely be in closed sessions with heavy media restrictions imposed.
I would urge everyone here to be a little wary of our media here. Like a lot of other countries around the world, they do not always get their facts straight and at times try not to let the facts get in the way of a good story. Especially our current affairs shows, where they usually have an agenda and choose who is going to be the victim/offender and will tweak the story to fit. Advertisers often wield much power over the media controlling what gets said about their companies and products. But that is true of any Western country.
I can still remember the Azaria Chamberlain ("The dingo took my baby!") case in the early 80's here. The media and police conduct was absolutely disgraceful. There are stories of political involvement too. It made me realise neither could be trusted to be impartial and do their jobs properly. It was really trial by media and police incompetence. She served some years in prison and has since been exonerated.
I have personally seen some stories I have had personal knowledge of over the years that the media got involved in where they presented an incomplete or misleading story to the public.
Anyway, I digress.
I certainly think this is all a tragedy for everyone involved and for all the families involved. There is not going to be a happy outcome for anyone here.
Firstly, because the child is under 18, we may never learn his identity due to child protection laws here and may never even find out family members involved. If the victim is unrelated, his name may be released if it does not identify the child.
The crime will be considered premeditated with intent, since he went from Ryde to Chatswood armed with a deadly weapon. Ryde is not far from Chatswood by the map, but takes a bit of effort to get there. The areas involved can get quite congested. So, plenty of time to reconsider and to dispose of the weapon.
Carrying anything that could be used as a weapon is frowned upon by the law here and heavy penalties can apply. If you have a baseball bat or a tyre iron in the car for protection and the police think this is your intent, expect to be charged. No public are permitted weapons for personal protection from other people over here. If you are at risk of being hurt by, say, an intruder then you can reasonably pick up something handy to defend yourself. If you are in the kitchen and pick up a knife to fend the attacker off, then that is considered a reasonable defence. If you kill him and he was unarmed, then you are in trouble under the use of reasonable force law. You are only really allowed to use a matching or slightly higher level of force your attacker is using. It tends to become a pretty grey area in courts.
We have had a number of cases here where the person defending themselves has ended up killing the aggressor. It isn't pretty for the defendant as the cases often drag out for a long time (sometimes years) and the legal costs are astronomical. Guilty or not, life often gets pretty hard then.
[bcolor=transparent]If the media refer to the boy as a Chinese National (if they got that fact right), it is likely he is not a citizen, but over here from China with his family on some sort of a Visa. So if found guilty (likely), probably serve some sentence (this is a big unknown factor, our courts do some pretty crazy things) and deportation afterwards. Any foreign national here automatically faces deportation if they serve 12 months or more prison time. This includes those who were born here if they have not been naturalized.[/bcolor]
Metal detectors are mainly only used here in airports, courthouses and major official buildings considered to be at risk. They are not in common use or in schools, etc.
Besides that, all factors leading to the incident [bcolor=transparent]will be considered [/bcolor]in court. Being a child (legally), he will not be tried in a open court, or by jury, but will be tried in the children's court by a judge with lawyers present. The hearing will likely be in closed sessions with heavy media restrictions imposed.
I would urge everyone here to be a little wary of our media here. Like a lot of other countries around the world, they do not always get their facts straight and at times try not to let the facts get in the way of a good story. Especially our current affairs shows, where they usually have an agenda and choose who is going to be the victim/offender and will tweak the story to fit. Advertisers often wield much power over the media controlling what gets said about their companies and products. But that is true of any Western country.
I can still remember the Azaria Chamberlain ("The dingo took my baby!") case in the early 80's here. The media and police conduct was absolutely disgraceful. There are stories of political involvement too. It made me realise neither could be trusted to be impartial and do their jobs properly. It was really trial by media and police incompetence. She served some years in prison and has since been exonerated.
I have personally seen some stories I have had personal knowledge of over the years that the media got involved in where they presented an incomplete or misleading story to the public.
Anyway, I digress.
I certainly think this is all a tragedy for everyone involved and for all the families involved. There is not going to be a happy outcome for anyone here.
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Leland
Crusader
Hi Fixer.
Please don't take this the wrong way...I am just interested.
Looking at Australian New these last couple days, I've noticed that using a knife in an attack is not that uncommon.
Just at a guess...are there heavy gun restrictions in Australia...and this leads to knives being the next weapon of choice...?
Please don't take this the wrong way...I am just interested.
Looking at Australian New these last couple days, I've noticed that using a knife in an attack is not that uncommon.
Just at a guess...are there heavy gun restrictions in Australia...and this leads to knives being the next weapon of choice...?
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The_Fixer
Class Clown
TheOriginalBigBlue
Gold Meritorious Patron
Just for the record, anyone know what they charge for the Purification Rundown there?
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