ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

take revenge on scientology, feat. why scientology was down last night

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by yid, Jan 19, 2008.

View Users: View Users
  1. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    If the CofS has no money, then yes, there would be no organizational structure. Very few orgs are viable as it is. How many would be if the staff had to be paid a livable wage too?

    People could get audited and trained without the CofS, with free market principles in use. If the Internet stays up, it would work OK, at the lower levels anyway. There are still many people in the FZ who want to do OT2 and OT3 and higher levels, despite the readily available materials and comments online. If the CofS were to disappear in short order, after a lot of confusion blowing off things would settle down and satisfactory delivery would occur. I mean, it couldn't really get much worse, could it?

  2. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Very true. Any action that is perceived to have been taken by an organisation is the result of action from one or more individuals with responsibility ranging from 1-100%.

    Those who focus too generally on "the Church" are likely stuck in an ARC-X.

    Focussing on a specific terminal such as DM makes more sense.
  3. alex

    alex Gold Meritorious Patron

    And focusing on the idiot MAA who imposed justice when sincere counselling on the optimum action would have been better...

    And focusing on the reg who sold his integrity for a stat to get you paid up for something that was not the best thing at the moment...

    And focusing on the scientologist who aborgated his personal responsibility to effectively communicate with his or her family and instead disconnects..

    and and and.

    A corporate entity IS a generalization.

    Yes DM is a good place to start focusing.

    alex (notice any signs of bpc in alex?)
  4. fishdaddy

    fishdaddy Patron

    Why become like them?

    One of the main reasons I left $cn was their "philosophy" that "the end justifies the means." You can do anything, any sort of dirty tricks you want, if it is in the name of "Clearing the Planet" or "protecting the Church." I disagree completely. The end does not justify the means. As Ghandi said, "Be the change you wish to see in the world." Dirty tricks and crimes are not justified just because they are "attacking the C of S."

    Those who don't want to join in the dirty tricks aren't compromosed, IHMO. Those that do, are.
  5. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    Good point. So many will use "the greatest good..." to justify any action.
    Sadly, that logic depends on Scn totally delivering what it promises, which it does not. There's no fanaticism on the road to enlightenment. Determination and persistence maybe, but no fanaticism.
  6. Royal Prince Xenu

    Royal Prince Xenu Trust the Psi Corps.

    Sorry. I consider hacking into someone's site the same as breaking down the front door and trashing the place. It is disrespectful and does not advance your cause in any beneficial way.

    The only such attack of which I've heard that I would pay to watch, I believe, occurred in Melbourne Australia at one of those G7 G8 (whatever the letters and numbers mean) conferences attended by Money Mongers like Bill Gates, the Packers, Conrad Black and the other wealthy elites of the world. I'm told that someone managed to break into the Hotel's security system, and locked all the doors, deactivated the lifts, wrought havoc with the airconditioning etc.

    Turning the very technology that these elites want to use to control us back onto them, was clever. Vandalizing someone's web page is just childish.

    Revenge is a dish best served cold, and preferably on fine silver.
  7. SchwimmelPuckel

    SchwimmelPuckel Genuine Meatball

    You know.. I would expect the scene to be like you desribe it! - I have always been convinced that judges, lawyers and police don't like to be played for fools by the Cult of Scientology..

    BUT!! - There was Keith Henson!

    The Sinister Cult of Scientology made a big issue out of Keiths post to ARS where he joked about 'Tom Cruise Missiles' aimed at the shitponds in Hemet.. This made the scientologists shiver from freight and made them afraid to get little spatters of shit all over them, and so they peed their beds!

    Keith was actually convicted for 'interfering with a religion', and the ruling didn't mention that the 'religion' was scientology btw. The court disallowed mention of Scientology and dismissed Cult Scripture describing Fair Game policy and how 'the law could be easily used for harrasment'..

    Well.. Has me scratching my head anyway!

    :screwy: seems to be under DDOS attack btw.. Or they use old Commodore 64'es for servers.

  8. Takin Time

    Takin Time Patron with Honors

    Can't you recognize a friend?

    You know, when you smack down people who try to help you (no matter whether it was good or bad help) people will quit trying to help you.

    I find too many ESMBers wrapped up in Scientology, still practicing it, still thinking the Scientology ethics and justice policies and the Code of Honor work in the real world. Nope. They only work in Scientology and they are part of the cult mindset and cult member control.

    The Church of Scientology is just another mind thug. And you have been, and are still, its victims if you buy into ANY of the philosophy.

    SchwimmelPuckel, you're right about the Keith Henson thing. Bizarre. Head on a pike; made an example of. Well it impinged on you guys, eh? Money can buy a lot of things and greases a lot of palms. And a court of law has a lot of machinations and rules, and if you don't know them or the opponent's lawyer is better than yours, you can get creamed! It doesn't matter that you're right or not.

    But what happened to Keith is not necessarily what will happen to everyone. Just look at all the other critics who are NOT harassed, who are NOT thrown in jail on bogus charges. That's more the win.

    Don't poo-poo someone's attempts to join the fray and spit at the Church of Scientology.

    Can't you recognize a friend? (And quit worrying about his possible "consequences".)
  9. Tanstaafl

    Tanstaafl Crusader

    I find that the majority of ESMBers grant beingness to their fellow members and are tolerant of other viewpoints. That (and the humour) is why I hang out here.

    If Ethics/Justice policies and The Code of Honor don't work for you, then fair enough. But that's not to say that others cannot extract something positive from them for use in the "real world". For the record, I don't use them at all.
  10. Anondelivers

    Anondelivers Patron

    Wave 2, perhaps featuring phase 2


    Tomorrow anonymous will strike again, harder this time.
    IRL action WILL be included... on what scale? Noone knows yet.

    But two things are for certain.
    Anon does not forgive, anon does not forget.
  11. LOLRonHubbard

    LOLRonHubbard New Member

    Yeah, any OTVIII in here?
  12. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    Welcome Fishdaddy!

    Good point!

    OHTEEATE Silver Meritorious Patron


    I'm an OT 8, but I don't know about ending Scientology. I've heard a lot of talk about it, but when push comes to shove, there are not enough eye witnesses to actual crimes who are willing to go to the FBI and give evidence. They are a recognized religion, and if Hillary Clinton is elected, they will be untouchable for at least 8 years. Also, they have a billion dollars to buy people off with. That helps.
  14. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    They probably couldn't get their CSW's approved for a Windows 95/486 machines as their servers.
  15. LOLRonHubbard

    LOLRonHubbard New Member

    "The wrong thing to do about any given circumstance or situation is to do nothing."
    -L Ron Hubbard

    Scientology is going too far. Talks of cleansing the planet are being heard coming from the mouths of high ranking officers in Scientology. Even respected historians are labeling these speeches in league with those delivered by Nazi Germany (source:

    Despite efforts in the past to stop Scientology, they continue to grow strong. Some of us feel more is needed in the name of justice to stop the spread of Scientology. Those that are venturing beyond the realm of peaceful intervention are doing what they feel is right.

    Sometimes, revolutions cannot be achieved through pacifism.
  16. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    I was a Scientologist for 16 years.

    Those respected historians are right. Scientology is on a par with Nazi Germany.

    But our civilization and its freedoms and rights can be protected WITHIN THE LAW.

    That's what needs to happen.

    Nothing else.

    Otherwise, the backflash from illegal and immoral actions will destroy the end result we are all hoping for.

    So believe me, your message gets me very excited. But you must remain WITHIN THE LAW to permanently achieve the ends we all want.
  17. Anondelivers

    Anondelivers Patron

    The ultimate goal of Anonymous in this battle is entirely legal. Were not going to suicide bomb CoS locations or anything like that, this whole so-called "raid" is only to attract media attention.

    We all know that no real results can be achieved by taking down scientology websites or keeping their phonelines busy... but something needs to be done and its a start.

    The next phases, if achieved, will affect CoS in a much deeper level, that i promise to you.

    But for those phases to succeed, we need much more information... we cant start getting the media involved with nothing in our hands.
    Sure, we have the documents and the videos of orientation etc, but we need actual evidence of illegal activities. That is perhaps the ultimate goal of this movement, making the public aware of this threat.
  18. 0rganism

    0rganism New Member

    Some of our people are somewhat overzealous, but do know our intentions, and motives are just, and noble. We're not actively using any illegal methods to bring them down(although being as our construct is not a stable one, some might do rogue missions and such), but some example of what we're doing range from handing out fliers near CoS centers, actively trying to get attention of media sources, and other forms of civil disobedience against the CoS.

    And we feel that some of your past experiences, and knowledge, and ideas could be vital o helping the cause.

    Also if you feel that we're heading in the wrong direction, we're open to suggestions.
  19. Div6

    Div6 Crusader

    This then is our common purpose. When the FBI raided the CoS in 1977 they carried off massive amounts of internal documents that detailed the Scn infiltration into govt agencies, operations to frame critics for crimes, and/or drive them insane, etc. The net result was the Founders wife taking the fall and going to jail.

    Since then, they have continued their patterns of harassment of critics, etc, but actual evidence and first hand accounts are difficult to come by. Supposedly Mike Rinder (once head of the Office of Special Affairs) has blown,. He would know where all the skeletons are buried, but so far he has chosen to remain silent....
  20. Anondelivers

    Anondelivers Patron

    Anon is here for you to use, we can not be harrassed, any effort they make in stopping us is another victory for us and will bring thousands more to join this movement.

    Any information or personal experiences you have and are willing to explain in detail is appreciated and will be published all over the internet and media. You have the power, we are the tool.

    I'd also like to add that[This comment is no longer available due to a copyright claim by Church of Scientology International]