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The ex-SO Hall of Shame

Discussion in 'Mike Rinders Blog' started by RSS Feed, Mar 17, 2019.

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  1. RSS Feed

    RSS Feed RSS Feeder Bot

    There is a new post up at the Mike Rinder's Blog

    The ex-SO Hall of Shame

    There are those who have left the Sea Org who were once privy to events in the world of David Miscavige. Many of them were in The Hole at one time or another. Rather than speaking out about the abuses they witnessed or experience, they have chosen to remain silent. A number of them have […]

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  2. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    Great post by Mike.

    When I first got that Debbie Cook email, I didn't even know she left the SO or Flag. I was like WTF, what's going on?

    There was a disturbance in the force. ( ie, the rhetoric of Hubbard).

    Why on earth would one leave the elite of the elite, the SO, mankinds watch dog, savior and keeping the tech pure for all to achieve OTness.
  3. ThetanExterior

    ThetanExterior Gold Meritorious Patron

    There is a guy who Mike considered a friend when in the SO. He was international management and now he's out and hasn't spoken a word about scientology yet Mike doesn't mention him. Strange.

    His name is Ron Miscavige Jr.
  4. Really? Does no one see the bullshit in this?

    Mike (Rinder, in case anyone is confused about which Mike I may be referring to) is best friends with the worst attacker of ex-Scn who speak out.

    Keeping traipsing around the world hugging your abusive unprofessional asshole Smith-Levin best friend.

    How can Mike ask people to speak out when he won't stand up and tell his best friend to knock it the fuck off.

    Time will tell the truth.
  5. Enthetan

    Enthetan Master of Disaster

    Everyone has his own circumstances, and makes his own choices.

    I speak out, but not under my real name. I have a job I don't want to be harassed at, and kids still in college. Maybe after I retire.
    Type4_PTS, JustSheila and DagwoodGum like this.
  6. Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton Patron with Honors

    Good point.
  7. Chris Shelton

    Chris Shelton Patron with Honors

    What did Aaron do now?
  8. PirateAndBum

    PirateAndBum Gold Meritorious Patron

    I'm not aware of Arron attacking any exes. What are you talking about?
  9. Dotey OT

    Dotey OT Cyclops Duck of the North - BEWARE

    I'm anxious to hear what Aaron has done. Maybe he is too.
  10. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    I'm with Enthetan on this one.

    It's a personal choice, right up there with human rights. My philosophy on this has changed over the years, though, and I didn't always feel that way.

    Anyone with a sense of personal integrity and conscience has to deal with the damage they've done in one way or another, but a lot of that damage was to themselves, too. There are many things to weigh. No one has an easy time rejoining society after leaving a cult. None of us can judge what goes on in another's mind or really know what they experienced, observed or felt afterward or the effects it would have on their job, family or other loved ones.

    Coming forward as an ex isn't just about giving. It gives the person who comes forward a tremendous freedom that I wish everyone could experience. Some can't or don't allow themselves that freedom. Sometimes there are good reasons, sometimes not, but none of us are qualified to judge.
  11. Narcissistic assholes are incapable of introspection so pointing it out to him is pointless. He already knows who he has attacked and is unapologetic to.

    I find it incredibly unprofessional for him to be out drinking beers with an applicant from the foundation and then turn around and blame it as a church attack. It could have easily been prevented by behaving professionally. Bragging about it on a video is much more fun though.
    Bea Kiddo likes this.
  12. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    . . .
    Perhaps y'all can help me see the light on something.

    I believe there's a clear line of demarcation on this subject.
    That is, two groups of individuals.

    Group one is like 99.99% of us who were simply conned or
    tricked into participating in all of this.

    Group two is the 0.01% that learned about the complete
    scam and falsity of promises and results, but yet kept on
    going and even inventing new lies and shore stories to keep
    the con going after LRH's death circa 1986-88.

    This was posted on Mike's site a while back and explains what
    I mean better than I could right now.


    Forever Lurker says
    September 25, 2018
    It’s always intrigued me, which of these guys were the inventors of the shore stories, the lies, and which were simply the enablers of the shore stories.
    We know Hubbard invented a so-called “science,” but how did he end up himself? I can only go by the actual outcomes it produced in him.
    Hubbard was very physically ill on and off from about 1968 to his death in 1986 (ages 57 to 75). Much more so than most people his age. He suffered from multiple bouts of pneumonia yearly at one time (admitted in a personal letter), heart attacks, strokes, pancreatitis (taken to hospital in early ’85 for a very bad attack . . . could not walk by himself), among other things.
    From age 64 on, he exhibited early signs of dementia or senility. I’m not a doctor so I can’t exactly describe it . . . but he had it. Something going on there. (From my readings of posts and discussions with people who worked directly with him face to face. Also, his personal doctor, Denk, has said as much, as corroborated by Bill Franks.) He suffered from an uncontrollable temper and rages as he got older.
    He wished to die in 1985 and attempted to take his life in November, so we’re told by his close friend and confidant, Sarge. In 1986, he volitionally withheld proper medical treatment at a hospital for a stroke or two, so he would die.
    By 1988, Marty along with Monique Yingling, Greg Whilhere, Miscavige, six PIs, and quite a few others had raided LRH’s former ranch at Newbury Springs and absconded with a treasure trove of LRH’s auditing folders and research notes. Marty and the other senior execs pictured above would have, should have known by then (with total certainty I’m guessing) that OT 9 & 10 didn’t exist in any way, shape or form. That the promises of the upper bridge were essentially unachieved, so essentially a fraud, and that LRH came to ignoble ending.
    Can you share with us who were the originators and perpetrators of the lies and false mythologies post-1986? These events and stories did not just “happen” out of the blue. They were caused and invented by somebody(s). The bridge turned into a volitional false act and carefully orchestrated fraud at that point. Who are the liars and who are the enablers here? Who were the members of the secret cabal that knowingly lied for decades?
    Otherwise, we have only a conspiracy of one, David Miscavige, and no one else knew a thing. Some have said as much.​
    Who invented the LRH achieved OT, LRH invincibility, and Target Two disembodied research stories after LRH’s death? DM? Broeker? Cooley? Who knew better but covered up the truth? Ray Mithoff?
    Who invented the story that OT 9&10 existed and would become available? That one cost me about $30K in a donation for a future imaginary level. The RTC that Marty was the head of at the time sent out a letter about it in the early 90’s and I paid up.
    Who wrote the Original OT 8 and which of the guys in the photo knew that it was not LRH? Who just went along to get along but knew better?
    My theory is that these guys are locked up because they know way too much and are too dangerous to be on the loose and free. If any of them talked and told the true details of the steps that were taken post-1986 to perpetuate the con, the COS would collapse pretty quickly. The easy solution then would be to keep them locked up and incommunicado until they pass away.
    I believe that all these stories and lies were invented by specific individuals and then others hid the actual truths they knew. It cost me a ton in cash and personal grief. I’d like to know the “who” or “whos” behind all this.
    Mike, what can you tell us?
    Mike Rinder says
    September 25, 2018
    Sorry. I don’t have time right now. You’ve asked a number of good questions here​
    and each is somewhat complex to answer.​


    I haven't been able to get ANYONE -- Marty or Mike or others -- to answer up with any actual
    names either. And I've asked them both about all this a few times too.

    I liken this all to the Bernie Madoff financial Ponzi scheme, which lasted twenty years or more. Was
    Bernie Madoff the ONLY one who was in on the scam? No, a whole secret floor of people were in on
    it, while a majority of the rest of his company had no clue. Many of those in on the massive theft
    of people's life assets (and lives) are in jail or will be there one day soon. The victims of the scam,
    of course, had no clue.

    I can easily forgive victims of a scam like Scientology. I would like to know the names of all the secret
    enablers though. Some of them are still roaming around and keeping this financial scam in place.
    Maybe it doesn't matter anymore and maybe nobody cares but me.

    I do know one thing: individuals invented the lies and shore stories. They did not just happen out
    of the blue.

    What do you think? :whistling:
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
    Operating DB and JustSheila like this.
  13. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    . . .
    This is the image of some of "the guys" being referred to in the previous post
    written by Forever Lurker. There may be more.


    Which of you invented the lies and shore stories after learning the "real truth"
    about LRH and the true nature and depth of the con?
    HelluvaHoax! and Gib like this.
  14. PirateAndBum

    PirateAndBum Gold Meritorious Patron

    Are you the aggrieved party?

    Do you have some evidence to present that counters Arron's recounting of events?
  15. ILove2Lurk

    ILove2Lurk Lisbeth Salander

    Two concrete examples, among dozens I could write about.

    Marty Rathbun is involved in the raid on Newbury Springs,
    searching for the missing OT 9&10 levels. He learns beyond
    a shadow of a doubt that they don't exist. Around 1988-90,
    Marty sends out a sales briefing on his RTC letterhead about
    OT 9&10, essentially fleecing parishioners of $30K a head for
    for something that he know LRH did not create or leave behind.
    It did not exist.

    He's knowingly involved in the post-death fraud.

    Ray Mithoff had studied LRH's folders and and he too knows
    OT 9&10 don't exist. OT 8 as written by LRH does not exist.
    He damn well knows LRH died a mess and was there to see it
    all go down. He sits and cobbles together a fake OT 8 to sell
    from gobbledygook notes left behind by a man he must have
    known was going batshit crazy. Many people at the upper
    management must have known.

    He's knowingly involved in the post-death fraud.

    I could go on all day, but won't. (This is my hobby horse topic.) :evillaugh:
    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
  16. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    and, of course, there is the LRH death event where Pat Broeker holds up notes of LRH's page with a bunch of zero's and one's denoting time.
  17. JustSheila

    JustSheila Crusader

    Great post. You're not wrong. With all my heart, I'm glad there are people in the world that think like you and Forever Lurker. If only all our judges in every justice system thought like you did, how much more sane things would be!

    But I don't believe I'm wrong, either. It's a matter of viewpoint, not of caring and not caring. Of course I care deeply. More than you will ever know. I didn't know about the scam and when it dawned on me, I left. I wasn't at Flag, never in Int Management, never met Hubbard or DM, wasn't anywhere close to anyone who would know anything like that so not in that picture at all. I'm not seeking justice. You are. I don't know the whole truth of who knew what and when and it's not important to me. It is important to you, though.

    I'm not tired of fighting Scientology. I don't feel things are all better and I haven't given up, either. I'm here, right next to you, fighting to expose a dangerous cult and raise others' knowledge and defenses against it because it's the right thing to do and I don't want innocent people sucked into it. But I don't expect personal justice or to ever learn the whole truth. Both of those things are too rare for something that big. Justice overall? Sure.

    You and I are coming at this from two different philosophies.

    I believe mental illness is genuinely illness. I don't believe many of the minor things currently tagged as mental illness are in the same category. But when we're talking about people completely sucked into Scientology to the point where they would knowingly and willingly lie, abuse, steal and con others, we're talking about real mental illness, like delusions of grandeur, a completely false concept of self and dissociation from a person's true nature, even dissociation from mankind. We're talking about whether psychopaths and sociopaths are born or made, whether or not they suffer, whether or not they can ever change or be helped. Heavy stuff.

    I've known real psychopaths and sociopaths close up, as well as types of schizophrenics and others that were way out there off their rockers insane and who didn't think twice about anyone's life having value but their own. Lies just slipped off their tongues on a regular basis. Other people were tools to be used and abused. Psychiatrists did not make them that way. Not in any of the cases I saw, anyway, and I saw a lot.

    They don't die happy, believe me. They would be lucky to have the opportunity to set things right with themselves and society and take that opportunity. They'll never do it, though. They're too far gone.

    This is where my philosophy comes in. I believe what ultimately made them that rotten and insane was betraying innocent people. Using trust, love, honesty and loyalty as tools to de-power another and empower the false persona. The more false a person becomes, the more they knowingly and intentionally hurt others, the less likely they'll ever regain themselves and the more their lives and minds become a personal hell, locked in a self-feeding cycle of destruction.

    I won't bore you with the myriad of religious references to this sort of thing. In my personal experience, though, it really happens.

    I don't worry about them getting justice. It is somehow built into human nature that a person cannot do things like that and remain sane or ever come close to experiencing joy or happiness.

    I care, ILove2Lurk. And I'm glad you're here. :bighug:
  18. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    it seems to me the cabal of shore stories is all who spoke at the LRH death event.
  19. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    I've listened to this many times. DM is a total lying con artist.

    Last edited: Mar 19, 2019
    HelluvaHoax! likes this.
  20. Gib

    Gib Crusader

    now at the 24:10 mark, Pat Broeker says this is OT10, Character, on the Bridge. and he says "when you do OT10, you'll understand"

    What a bunch of bullocks since time has marched forward from that LRH Death Event.

    ThetanExterior and PirateAndBum like this.