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Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by owl, Feb 23, 2009.

  1. Human Again

    Human Again Silver Meritorious Patron

    'Cause I really could have used a reg cycle like that when I was in. The starvation for lack of other viewpoints is a killer. How could I leave someone to go hungry?
  2. Happy Aberree

    Happy Aberree Patron with Honors

    I think I know what you are getting at, Owl, about letting a person do what they want and be what they want. I firmly believe in that. But I think the whole point of this site is many people in the church are NOT happy there. And they are the one's who could use some alternate viewpoints.

    I mean -- so many of us here WERE THERE weren't we?

  3. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    That's the insanity of it. They probably don't worry about how it's accounted for. It's all about the individual stat for that post. There's that much pressure. . My poor husband was on staff before he left and I saw how things worked a bit.

    Once after we separated I was phoned by him from our mission saying he had a one time offer made to him. If he could sell a Levels 0 to IV auditor training package for a staff to go to a class VI org and train, he would recieve the same likewise for free. It was part of a push to get more auditors working in the missions and orgs. I did not really have the money but I loaned it to the treasury sec so she could rehat.

    My hubby did not get his levels awarded to him and nothing was made of it as the mission did not deserve the award from org afterall as they owed it money in arears.

    One time I signed over a bank draft to the org for 4 prepaid intensives. I'd had no processing in yrs. I already had over a hundred auditing hrs in my acct at the time.. But the note came up from the D of P that there was an AMAZING program that was lined up for me by the C/S. However, they did not want to start me on it if it wasn't guaranteed I could complete the entire program. Great.

    I went into session and completed the C/S and acheived the EP of the entire program in 6 hrs. That left me still about 100 hrs on account. hmmmm...hmmmm. :eyeroll: I'd only just signed the bank transfer slip down at the treas sec's desk on Saturday evening...this was now only Sunday evening. :happydance:

    My next action would be at AOLA so I did not need to buy those EXTRA intensives from the Org afterall! We still did not have a class IV auditor with
    valid certs at our mission so that was a mute point.
    I decided to call the bank and tell them not to put through the bank draft on Monday as I'd not be needing the service. BOY oh, BOY, oh Boy!!:omg: I did not realize as a young 20 year old that I would be cleaning the Org toilets and bleaching down the hallway walls for four days.:unsure:

    I had to do this to get out of treason for my faux pas. And of course I had to make the money good! I have 4 more similar sad anecdotes about how my money was managed. That Org to its credit though usually had the highest of ARC with its public and the staff were not broke. I think that they had received so many paper transfers instead of money to audit clients of folded missions that it was now going to be their turn to send just a paper transfer to the AO for my services when I got there. The sad inner politics of it.

    Back home, my ex-hubby left staff giving up on the idea that he would ever receive his training and audit for the mission. He was subsequently given a freeloaders deb't after working full time for room and board.

    He decided to take advantage of an opportunity for more money working in the huge metropolitan area of the org which was several hundred miles from our local mission. He would work off his freeloaders debt and start new. He would go down there briefly, not more than 3 months and open a chain store and return. He could be on course part-time.

    I remember his sad goodbye as he came by my workplace the fateful day that he left. He really wanted to reconcile when he got back. He wanted me to STOP him from going. But he needed the money as he was broke and penniless when he left staff.

    He did not make it back after 3 months though. There was an incident shortly after he got down there. The last time I saw him was in a hospital with metal pins and braces strapped to his neck and head. He had been making out payroll in the back office of the new store when it was robbed. Four young men came in with guns and masks and had everyone down on floor. They were about to leave when startled by him sitting behind a glass wall at a desk with a phone.

    A bullet severed his spinal cord. He was never the same. He remained a quadraplegic for 25 yrs until his death. Absolutley no use of his limbs.

    He was an illegal pc back then when he relocated to be near family and heal near his Illinois org. It was difficult for him to get auditing as he was always on meds. He never gave up trying though. He even flew out to see doctor Denk ( Ron's doc) in a special trip out to Calif.

    When he passed away several years ago he had one of his brothers fly down with his ashes and bring them to Pier 60 in Clearwater. There they were scattered. He had never let go of Scientology and wanted to reincarnate as the child of a rich FCCI. (Flag Public). He just had so many barriers put in his way because of money and inside politics. The org in Illinois gave him many assists and such. But the only thing he wanted was certaintly of self as a being before leaving this life. He ended up getting a return of money from his auditing account as he felt it was all hopeless for him. He couldn't even finish his CCRD because he had to be on medication to prevent atrophy. Later it didn't matter as his hands did atrophy and he could not hold the cans. I do not know if pcs are still considered "illegal" or not. But this one doctrine left him sad and depressed and he told me on the phone that he was having a substance abuse problem. But, hey, he couldn't be audited anyhow so...was how he felt about it.

    It's a wordy post, but the thread was entitled thoughts..
    Last edited: Feb 24, 2009
  4. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    That's a good point that Owl made.

    Does anyone really know if anyone experienced the OT III drama as being just the way Ron explained it. Such a large sector has so many vectors from which the action could be viewed. Alternate perceptions of it?

  5. owl

    owl Patron with Honors

    yeah i see what you mean. you could always mention it or whatever and see if maybe they want to hear that but are scared or whatever. i know a lot of people though that are in it are really happy and really want to be there
  6. Iknowtoomuch

    Iknowtoomuch Gold Meritorious Patron

    I'm not sure what you mean. Remember this is Scientology, what Hubbard says IS true. Changing anything is no longer Scientology.
    There's nothing theological about the Xenu story at all. He means it outright and I don't know how you get another meaning from a story like that.

  7. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    I've often felt that CofS members should not be allowed to call up public on the phone. Or other staff. What I mean is they really really suck at it.
  8. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    "Theological" does not mean allegorical. A lot of ologies and isms intend their theological dogma to be taken literally.
  9. Iknowtoomuch

    Iknowtoomuch Gold Meritorious Patron

    As does Hubbard.
  10. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader

    Point Made

    Well, assuming that others have their own point of view from which to participate in the drama of life there would have to be perspectives. How could you be dogmatic about it..A mistake to make it that way.
  11. TomatoTester

    TomatoTester Patron

    1/ Is there, in the U.S., any equivolent of the "Data Protection Act" which we have here in the UK ?

    Here, to hold *any*ones personal records/details (PC Folders lol), you must be licensed to do so, and must produce said records upon request.

    2/ In addition to above... credit card details. It is illegal to take money from anyones card without express authorisation to do so. Unless an agreement has been made to debit a certain amount on a regular basis, any Credit Card Co is obliged to refund to you any monies taken without your express authorisation.
  12. Wisened One

    Wisened One Crusader

    You are doing the right thing by not answering their calls anymore. They are mindless ronbots that must sell you something for their 'stat'. I know, I used to have to do the same thing! (Though never sold 'big' things like that!). I had to always be getting new people interested in dn and scn! Ugh! :duh:

    They will stop calling you, eventually.

    Just ignore them, and live your life! Go out to the movies, eat some yummy food out at a restaurant or even fast-food, make lots of new friends, go out with them, laugh often! :yes:

  13. Iknowtoomuch

    Iknowtoomuch Gold Meritorious Patron

    Are we still taking about the OTIII story about Xenu? You're trying to tell me there are other opinions about it? Hubbard is telling it because he thinks it's factual.
    You want to put another spin on it and add opinions about that story, that's fine but no ones opinion changes what Hubbbard said or the fact he thought it was true.
  14. Hatshepsut

    Hatshepsut Crusader


    So.... I seem to be asking for others' realities on a time period as if it were an actual historical fact. Could be delusion. It's his story, he told it his way, its not open for modification.
    I had absolutely NO reality on his story. Hubbard made it dogma like his take on things had to be true for everybody. It was a mistake for him to do that. I was hunting to see if maybe there was a perspective on it I'd missed.
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2009
  15. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    If any person or entity is debiting anyone's debit or credit card without authorization, that can be disputed with the bank. Believe me, they will credit you if you keep on 'em on that. I know because I've done it- and I used to work in that field.
  16. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Reversing an unauthorized credit card transaction may be relatively easy but it will often get you in trouble with the org concerned, even though they committed a crime in doing it! As we all know.

    But a question, fluff. I got a (non-CofS) credit card charge reversed, which was fraudulent. This was with B of A, I think. Shortly thereafter they jacked up my interest rate. At the time it wasn't a problem as I didn't carry a balance from month to month. But is that a normal thing? In other words, do they tend to jack up the interest rate as a penalty for reversing charges, just like an insurance company sometimes jacks up your premium if you make a claim?

  17. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    Credit cards are the wild west. They can pretty much do anything they want, for any reason they want. Your only recourse in most cases is to get another card and transfer any balance then thumb your nose at them.

    Check your 'credit reports', because there may be fraudulent entries there.

  18. skydog

    skydog Patron Meritorious

    David Miscaviage sucks

    Just a suggestion. Identify yourself as a homicide detective investigating your death. Obtain as much pedigree information on the caller as they are now a material witness that will need to be questioned by the police. By asserting a homicide detective valence, you can push these people around and have a little fun.
  19. Dulloldfart

    Dulloldfart Squirrel Extraordinaire

    Wouldn't that be illegal? I'm not sure as there's a hilarious YouTube video of someone doing exactly that.

  20. Axiom142

    Axiom142 Gold Meritorious Patron

    Impersonating a police officer is certainly an offence over here.

    I wouldn't recommend it.

    But, debiting your credit card account without your consent is fraud. So, if this happens to you, then report it to the police.

    In fact, if the CoS (or any other organisation for that matter) stores your credit card number after your initial transaction without telling you that they are doing that, then it could be construed as a breach of the Data Protection Act in the UK. And, if they store this number in an insecure fashion (i.e. not encrypted and / or in a insecure area) then this is certainly a breach of that act.

    This is actually a very serious matter, if they get caught too many times, they could be prevented from holding any financial information on their customers.

    So, please report any abuses that you are aware of.