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What is an ex scientologist?

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Emma, Aug 31, 2007.

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  1. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I have been wondering about this for a while.

    I presume most of you consider yourselves "exes" (excluding those who were never in) considering you post here, but what exactly is an "ex"?

    It seems to be a loose term because we have all sorts of people here. I'd like to get some sort of an idea of what defines an ex (if possible).

    Maybe you don't consider yourself an ex but post here anyway - which is fine too.

    What are your ideas on this?
     
  2. ExScnDude

    ExScnDude Patron with Honors

    Emma,

    That is really a loaded question.

    For myself, I was on staff for so long that I believe my viewpoint in life is to some degree forever colored by the experience.

    Even after being "uninvolved" for more than ten years, I still think like a Scientology staff member in many ways. For instance, in my profession, I am completely unable to have periods of "no production" - unlike many of my colleagues.

    I tend to get pissed when someone attempts to manipulate me into producing above and beyond what would normally be expected of anyone.

    I could go on and on ..... :)

    In the end, for me being an ex-Scientologist is more about NOT supporting the suppressive and denigrating use of other beings to further the accomplishment of one's own selfish goals. Being an EX is about not supporting the creation of an artificially dangerous environment in order to enslave and own other people.

    Personal opinion: Scientology in many ways has been about creating for oneself some god-like identity where all that matters is getting up the bridge and getting bigger and bigger .......

    But I think that in life, real success is obtained by placing the most emphasis on being responsible for others - and enhancing the survival of the people you are connected with.

    LRH demanded by force of pain that other's worship him as some kind of demi-god.

    Despite all of that technology, the poor guy had it exactly backwards.

    ExScnDude
     
  3. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Well, I suspect it means different things to different people.

    So...I would personally think that if a person was an FZer or an indie Scn'ist or anything where they think of themself as being a Scn'ist but have left CofS, that they'd be an ex CofS member who currently is a Scn'ist.

    If they've ditched the whole dang thing, then I think they'd be an ex Scn'ist, no qualifiers.

    I think it would be whatever that person considers him or herself to be.
     
  4. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor

    To understand the term "ex-Scientologist" one must look at how it came about in the first place. Then, of course, it's meaning would have evolved differently for different people.

    So the point of agreement would occur at the time of formation of this term.

    Was this term first used on an expulsion order by the Church, or on some suppressive declare?

    I am not very certain about it. But, this would be the place to start.

    Is anybody there who knows this for certain? Alan?

    .
     
  5. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    The term ex-scientologist occurred long before SP declares.

    It meant someone who once had been fairly involved and had several services - and now no longer had much to do with Scio.

    I remember running into ex-scios in Melb in 1961. (They called themselves that.)

    It just evolved.:eyeroll:

    An SP was an SP - nothing Ex about them!

    Then came so many declares it lost its power - anybody can be an SP nowdays! :grin:

    Alan
     
  6. Vinaire

    Vinaire Sponsor


    Thanks, Alan.

    That is a pretty earthy definition, then.

    What were you thinking, Emma?

    .
     
  7. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    FZers should call themselves ex-CofS and not ex-SCN just as an ex-Roman Catholic but who is now, say, a Congregationalist is NOT an ex-Christian.

    A person who was a Scientologist but now rejects most of the core beliefs of Scientology would be an ex-Scientologist.

    I think that this is pretty simple.
     
  8. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I'm not sure we need to look to the CoS for a definition of the word "ex". They didn't coin that word.

    From Wiki:


    The prefix ex- first appeared in English words in the Middle English in words borrowed from French. It comes from the Latin where it was both a prefix and a preposition. Later in the Middle English period it became a productiveAncient Greek (εκ-, εχ-, εχω-). Its meaning ranges from prefix. It is akin to
    • 1. "out, away" (example exit)
    • 2. "up" (abstract meaning indicating increase or strengthening of a particular quality, often negative - sometimes called intensive) (example exaggeration, exacerbate)
    • 3. "former, prior" (examples ex-boyfriend, ex-president) This is a much later development and did not exist in Latin.

    and:

    Etymology

    From Latin ex-.

    [edit] Prefix

    ex-
    1. out of extract, expel, except, expression, etc.
    2. outside ex-directory
    3. former (but still living) ex-husbandex-president
    But LRH did invent the term Scientology:

    From the CoS website:

    Scientologist: one who knows he has found the way to a better life through Scientology and who, through Scientology books, tapes, training and processing, is actively attaining it.

    Scientology: Scientology applied religious philosophy. It is the study and handling of the spirit in relationship to itself, universes and other life. Scientology means scio, knowing in the fullest sense of the word and logos, study. In itself the word means literally knowing how to know. Scientology is a “route,” a way, rather than a dissertation or an assertive body of knowledge. Through its drills and studies one may find the truth for himself. The technology is therefore not expounded as something to believe, but something to do.


    And here is where my confusion lays.

    To me Scientology is the whole of the writings, tapes, books, lectures etc. It's everything LRH created. Not just the "nice" bits.

    I don't understand how someone can call themselves a Scientologist, whether it be a FZer or Indi, yet actively reject part of the teachings.

    LRH said himself that squirrels are NOT Scientologists. Yet isn't picking out only bits and pieces of the "tech" and completely ignoring other bits of the tech "squirreling"?

    Not having done any FZ or indi services I admit I might have things wrong here, but this is how I see it.

    A lot of people find some good in the auditing tech of Scn, yet find the policies of disconnection, the RPF, overboarding, lower conditions, freeloader bills, baby watching, high security etc etc to be abberant Yet it was the same guy, the same author, the same source that came up with this stuff as came up with the "nice" stuff. So if you only pick & chose what bits of Scientology you use, you aren't really a Scientologist as per the founders own definition. Isn't that what "keeping Scientology Working" was all about?

    So how is it that someone like Fluffy still calls herself an Indi "Scientologist"? Is it just lack of a better word? Or am I missing something here? I don't mean to pick on you Fluffy, it's just that you are a good example of my confusion about these terms.

    I've probably derailed my own thread here but this question has been on my mind for a long time.
     
  9. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    Having once been married to Scientology - and 30 years ago this week I separated and then divorced myself from Scio. I became an Ex-Mr-Scientologist! :)

    As for using bits of Scio - the fact is Hubbard used bits of most long term life actions - an example is - processes have been around as long as the first postulate.

    Talking to a person in such a way that they can understand and getting answers that you can understand and acknowledging - has been around for ever. Its called good communication.

    Etc., etc.

    Alan
     
  10. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I get what you are saying but I wasn't referring to the ancient philosophical stuff. I was more meaning the actual auditing technology - Running out engrams with Dn, running the Grades and OT levels, following Ethics and Admin technology as laid out by Hubbard.

    "Squirrels" (for want of a better word) still follow these Hubbard teachings, yet don't follow Hubbard teachings in other areas. They pick & chose. Yet they still call themselves Scientologists. Per the founders own definition they are NOT Scientologists. Maybe they are rejecting LRH's definition of his own religion.
     
  11. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    So lemme get this straight then.... (just to confuse you more, Emma...). A Scientologist would be someone who is on the path to, or who is discovering truth. Thats by the big cheeses definition, right?

    So an ex-Scientologist would be someone who is no longer looking for truth (or cares to know truth). By their definition.

    So are we looking for lies?

    ----

    Honestly Emma, I took your question as a survey kind of question. You know, what does that mean to each of us. I beleive everyone on this board has their own idea of what that means to them. Its gonna have 4500 shades of grey in it.
     
  12. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    The "truth" meaning "the truth as stated by L Ron Hubbard".

    No. To me Scientology is NOT the truth. I reject that "truth". I still seek answers to the big questions, I'm not looking for more lies.

    A Scientologist is someone who buys Ron's "truth". That truth is contained in his lectures & writings....or maybe some of his writings and lectures....or maybe just the nicer writings and lectures.... :eyeroll:



    It started out a bit like a survey, but as I said I probably derailed my own thread. I don't have all the answers and sometimes I like to participate in a bit of discussion too.
     
  13. Björkist

    Björkist Silver Meritorious Patron

    It all depends on what a Scientologist is...so maybe we should query CST?

    Among X-ians, there are divergent views on the nature of God, the afterlife, abortion, homosexuality, which part so the bible they apply, or don't apply...(How "Christian" is it for George Bush to order young men and women into battle while he plays golf?)

    But if asked, they will claim Christianity...even though there may be vast differences in the application (or non-application) of their religion.

    Ultimately it's just a labels and words...but it does, IMO, denote an adherence to certain Scientological principles AND if the person considers themselves that.
     
  14. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    Yo, Ems,

    I read all the definitions of Scientologist in the tech dictionary. There's nothing in there that says that a cafeteria Scn'ist (for lack of a better term...this one'll do) is not a Scn'ist or shouldn't be called that.

    I have read and reread- and even posted- those definitions before- since people have said things to me about that, over the years. Hubbard didn't list any exclusionary traits.

    He could have. I bet if you'd have been able to ask him- he'd probably back up exactly what you are saying. But he didn't say it.

    He did bitch about squirrelling, though. Like I said, he'd not have approved of me or taanstafl or haiqu or Terril or TI or Alan or a bunch of others...but going by the "tech dict" well, too bad for the cult. They don't like it, I'm sure, but some heretics are gonna continue using that particular moniker.

    Argumentatively but lovingly,
    C
     
  15. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    The problem is; the conflict of what the client wants handled, what the client wants to achieve, what the client is interest in - versus following what LRH wants.

    If you follow the clients goals, wants and interest line you will depart from what LRH wanted.

    The great processors - process only what the client wants.

    To do that you have to leave Scio.

    In my case I process the positive - that is a 180 degree vector from where the LRH directed tech is aimed.

    Alan
     
  16. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    Perhaps it would be better if we each answer what being an Ex-Scio means to us. :)
     
  17. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    I'm not saying this is a bad thing. I think you are missing my point.

    You don't call yourself a Scientologist.

    You do something different and call it something different.

    Others do something different and call it Scientology.
     
  18. Voltaire's Child

    Voltaire's Child Fool on the Hill

    I kinda thought that's what we were doing, but I'm sure things have meandered a bit.

    We're peripatetic, that way.
     
  19. Emma

    Emma Con te partirò Administrator

    That would be good too! :D
     
  20. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    I think you asked an interesting question, and, although I've never been a Scientologist, I expect I'll weigh in here somewhere.

    But, for the moment, I'm reading the replies.

    Good question Emma.

    Worthy of discussion.

    Zinj