ESMB has entered archive mode. All posts and threads that were available to the general public are still readable. The board is still searchable. 

Thank you all for your participation and readership over the last 12 years.

If you want to join in the conversation, please join the new ESMB Redux at

What went on in the Cadet Org?

Discussion in 'Staff "War Stories"' started by duddins, Nov 11, 2007.

  1. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious

    Sitting down over dinner with my brother Danny, who is now 41 years old, I told him that I was reconnecting with Ex-Scientologists and SO members. He rolled his eyes and said "Oh shit."

    He started to laugh. It was good to see him in this condition, almost 100% back to being the brother I had almost lost forever.

    My brother, mom and dad had joined the SO at CCLA in around 77 or 78. They lived over at the Wilcox building. My brother was 10-11 years old. After a time, they moved to the PAC complex, my dad became a FOLO missionaire and my brother was rounted into the Cadet Org. Mom never got into the groove of things and was kept on MEST work most of the time.

    He told me something that was rather shocking........

    He said that while dad was on mission and mom was on perpetual MEST work, he had spent his days running the streets around the complex. He made friends with an older kid who lived near by (a non-scientologist). He told me that it was during this time that he was first introduced to drugs.
    Marijuana, LSD, speed, etc. This went on until he was 14 years old when mom and dad routed out of the SO. He withheld the information for years.

    I only recently got my brother back, now three years clean with an addiction to Methamphedimines. It broke my heart to hear that he started taking drugs while a child in the SO.

    What went on over there at the cadet org? Does anyone know? Kids were not allowed to be with their parents.....They were supposed to be taken care of.

    I was at Flag, thinking all was well. I wasn't there to oversee what was happening to my little brother. To see the indicators of drug abuse. I don't know how my folks missed that one.

    Who was minding the store? Does anyone have similar stories about the Cadet Org and how the children were managed?

  2. Free to shine

    Free to shine Shiny & Free

    Zoe Woodcraft Declaration

    This was posted on OCMB by Snow White recently. It is a very long read ( about 10 pages) so I have only posted the first part here.
    I don't know if it answers some questions as I get confused about locations, but the story is universal.

    Posted: Mon Nov 05, 2007 9:01 am Post subject: Zoe Woodcraft Declaration

    I, Zoe Woodcraft declare as follows:

    1. I am 16 years of age.

    2. The statements herein are of my own personal knowledge and if called upon as a witness, I can testify competently thereto.

    3. In 1986, when I was two years old, my parents and 15-year-old brother joined the Sea Organization at the Flag Land Base in Clearwater, Florida. My seven-year-old sister and myself were put into the care of the Cadet Organization at this time. My family and I lived at a building on U.S. Highway 19 called the "QI" which was an acronym for Quality Inn. This building was once a Quality Inn hotel. The cadet organization was located there.

    4. The room we were assigned to live in was very small, approximately 12'X 20'. It was one room and one bath; very shabby, infested with cockroaches and smelling of mold. All five of us were in this room so it was very cramped and nearly unlivable.

    5. My parents were shocked when we were first shown these living quarters. When they had been recruited to come into the Sea Organization to work for Flag they had been promised a new, two bedroom apartment in the Hacienda Garden complex; that we children would go to private school and that they would get one day off every two weeks. We soon found out none of this was true.

    6. After about a year we returned to England to take care of our visas. I remember being in England and playing with a cousin and not wanting to return to Florida and our horrible living conditions.

    7. I also remember my father being suddenly sent away and I had no idea when he might return. This frightened me, as I feared I would never see him again. I was told he had been sent to the ship but no one could tell me when he would return. He did return after 6 months.

    8. We lived in Florida for about two years and then my mother was transferred to Los Angeles.

    9. In Los Angeles I was placed in the "CEO" which stood for the "cadet estates organization." This was a building located next to Celebrity Center International. This is where I lived, by myself, for the next two years. My parents and brother were placed in adult living quarters and my older sister into the Cadet Org down the street. This building housed only younger children. We did not live with our parents, but were assigned to the care of "nannies."

    10. Eventually my father had to take a leave of absence from the Sea Org to further take care of visa problems. He rented an apartment at this point and our family moved in. He then began working for a company owned by a Scientologist. He was supposed to work in this company for one year in order for our family members to obtain green cards. Technically, I lived in this apartment with my parents, however because both of my parents worked such long hours I would be taken to the CEO in the early morning and then picked up by my parents late in the evening. This was my basic schedule until I was six years old.

    11. When I was six I was moved to what is called the "Int Ranch." This is a compound in Happy Valley, CA. We were told that this was a secret location and I was instructed not to tell my father where it was as he and my mother were now divorced and my father was no longer in the Sea Org.

    12. I was placed in a dorm that was acceptable; i.e. nice carpet, neat etc. However, neither of my parents lived on premises and there was a sixteen year-old boy named Sterling Thompson who was in charge of about twenty of us younger children, known as "pre-cadets." All together there was a staff of about six or eight adults who ran the compound and about one hundred children living there.

    13. My schedule at the ranch was: wake up at 7:00 a.m., take one half hour to get dressed for the day then go to breakfast. Meals were highly regulated. We were assigned seats and each table had a "table captain" who made sure the assigned steward brought our food from the kitchen to the table. It was placed on the table and we served ourselves. Afterward we cleaned our own tables. We had half an hour to eat.

    14. After breakfast we worked, dumping trash, mopping floors, sweeping etc. We were assigned cleaning stations throughout the compound. All our work was supervised by Sterling. We worked for about 20 minutes.

    15. We then went to school for four hours with one fifteen minute break. Often, the school schedule was changed. Sometimes we did four hours in the morning and two at night, after working in the afternoon, and sometimes we did six hours straight.

    16. Most of what I studied was Scientology materials. I remember doing the Basic Study Manual when I was six or seven years old and it was very difficult for me. This is a course geared for adults. When I did not score well on the final test, the instructor first told me to redo sections of the course and then told me to redo the entire course. I then had to start all over on this course. The only other subjects studied were reading and math.

    17. After school, we had half an hour for lunch, and then we lined up and did group drills. We did "left/right/left marching, chanting of Scientology doctrines, and relay races to increase our "particle flow" so we could work faster. Then we received our work assignments for the afternoon.

    18. The work consisted of such things as collecting rocks from a stream, putting them in a wheelbarrow and taking them to where a stone wall was being built; raking the football field after it had been mowed; and weeding. Most of the time we pulled weeds as the appearance of the compound was very important. We were often told how lucky we were to be allowed to live here. We worked all afternoon from lunch to dinner.

    19. Before dinner, we showered. After dinner, we went to study for two more hours.

    20. One thing that occurred some months after I had been there was that one afternoon we were all gathered up and directed to go to a house that was for what we called the "big boys." This was the house that Justin Miscavige lived in with several other boys. It was a very nice place, much better than the dorms. They had art paintings on the wall, whereas in our dorms we were only allowed pictures of L. Ron Hubbard or the Apollo ship. They also had different colors on the walls and the bedding, whereas the dorms were in nautical colors: navy and gold. There was no house for the big girls. Older girls just lived in the dorms with us younger children.

    21. The day we were taken to the big boys house we were told to stay inside. I was told by the adult watching us that what was happening was we had too many kids at the ranch and a health inspector had come to check on us. So, we were hiding until he was gone.

    22. In describing my bedroom, I again state all bedrooms were done in dark colors. Bedspreads were navy with a gold Sea Org symbol imprinted on them. The curtains were navy; the carpet was blue. We had brown dressers upon which we were not allowed to place personal items or family photos. We were not allowed to hang any personal photos or pictures; only the LRH or Apollo pictures.

    23. One of the courses I had to do soon after arriving was the "make the bed" course. I had to learn how to fold the sheet corners so the bed was perfectly tucked and no wrinkles on anything. The final drill was making a perfect bed in less than five minutes.

    24. At the ranch we dressed in uniforms. These consisted of khaki shorts with a red t-shirt or polo shirt with the Sea Org emblem embroidered on it. We also had sweat pants and dress pants and a vest. We could not wear our own clothes ever while on the ranch with the exception of pajamas.

    25. As far as free or play time, there was none. Every aspect of our time was scheduled and controlled. Sometimes in the summer we were given twenty-five minutes to swim but that is all.

    26. At the ranch there is also a form of punishment called "pigs berthing." This is levied against those who had a dirty dorm or dorm area. The punishment varies in different cadet orgs, but in this one offenders had to spend the night in what was called "The big house." The big house was an abandoned building with rotting floorboards and broken windows filled with insects, rats and bats. I clearly recall two girls about nine years old who were forced to spend the night there and in the middle on the night they ran screaming and crying from the building. One of the girls afterward told me that they had been terrified by the bats and couldn't stand it anymore.

    27. This ranch was hours away from normal civilization. In the year plus that I lived there we never went into town for a field trip; never went to a movie, shopping or anything. We were totally isolated. The only time I ever left was when I was allowed once to take a leave of absence to visit my father at Christmas.

    28. At the age of seven I was also made an MAA. This is a person who watches out to make sure no one is slacking in his or her work and to write reports when other children are misbehaving. For example one incident I had to write up on myself was when I had snuck into a snack shack and taken a bite of someone's candy bar. Another boy was made to stand up in front of the group and list off things he had stolen, such as a pen from a teacher. He listed about thirty such incidents of having taken or borrowed things without asking. This was extremely humiliating for him - he was about ten years old - and the next day he was kicked off the ranch.

    29. Every Friday night my mother came at about 2:00 in the morning to pick me up in a car. We would return to her housing about half hour away and I would visit her until 12:00 noon the next day. This was the extent of my time with her. On alternate weeks, when I was to visit my father, my mother arranged for a friend of hers to pick me up and take me to my father's house as my father was forbidden to come to the ranch. I would stay there with my dad over night until 10:30 a.m. then I would have to return to the ranch. I often asked to stay longer, but I was always refused permission. This often upset my father and me. I felt like I had spent a lot of my life saying goodbye to my father.

    30. The last few weeks I was at the ranch, I learned my mother had been sent to New York on a mission. After she was gone about three weeks, I was sent to be with her.

    31. I was now in Manhattan. Here, I lived in a room with my mother. There was a bunk bed and I slept on top and she on the bottom. This room was relatively clean and nice as my mother was an "Int Missionaire" which meant she was highly ranked and the other staff members were frightened of her authority.

    32. My schedule here was to hang out all day with six or seven other kids also in the building. I did no schooling during the entire time I was in New York, which turned out to be eleven months. My mother once asked me if I wanted to go to public school, but I thought public school was horrible and "the enemy" as this is what I had been taught all my life. I told her I didn't want to go and she said ok. While in New York, I turned eight.

    Follow the link to read much more -
  3. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious

    Thanks FTS! This is an interesting tale.

    Yes indeed! The separation of parent from child was universal in the SO. So sad for these children.

    However, I actually wish my brother had been put on a strict schedule. Or at least someone caring about his well being. But being separated from his family, he was left free to wonder around LA looking for something to do no doubt.

    His tale took place at the PEO, Pac Estates Org specifically the Cadet Org which was based in an old building on Fountain across from the complex. Some of the details are still fuzzy......My brother is just starting to recall.

    Thank you again for passing on this story.
  4. pomfritz

    pomfritz Patron with Honors

  5. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    I was in and out of the Cadet Org and CEO from 1975 to 1986. In PAC.

    The same problems still existed during the time I was there.

    They finally totally got rid of the CEO and only had the Cadet Org, to prep children for the SO. CEO was for babies and toddlers.
  6. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious

    I want to thank you for passing on this link. It tells me that the proplem was known about at higher levels. I am dumbstruck.

    Here is a quote from the link you advised us to check out: It refers to the findings of an obs mission back in 1981, when my brother would have still been there.

    "The eval goes on to say that there are "Numerous reports of out-ethics and criminal behavior by PAC children, i.e. out 2-D, stealing, etc." and "Due to the recent filthy conditions of the CEO [Cadet Estates Org] and the criminal behavior of the children the area has become a PR [public relations] and Legal threat to the Church."

    In the section of the Aides Order where the specific findings (data) are reported, it says, "...CEO scene is wildly off the rails and the scene has become very degraded. PAC SO children instead of becoming valuable personnel assets are in many cases becoming criminals...Looking into the scene it was found that except for brief periods, there has NEVER BEEN a properly functioning Cadet Org and CEO as separate entities....."

    By the looks of it, this observation was not aggressively handled...but continued at least until 1986....

    Wouldnt it have been remotely decent if they could have taken responsibility and done something to repair the damage done to the kids, and families?
  7. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious

    This is tragic beyond words.
  8. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    Its black core genesis of this is the attempt to get power and domination over others without responsibility.

    Hate, greed, envy and jealousy of someone getting more power or recognition, etc., fuels this evil empire.

    Every person that tried to short cut the evolutionary process needed to gain mastery over a subject or thing added power to this evil.

    Parents were willing to abandon their children for this.

    Staff hated the children for interfering with their attempts to get power.

    Staff hated the public because they were free to come and go.

    Staff hated each other because one was given status and another was not.

    Very sick! :puke2:

  9. TheSneakster

    TheSneakster Guest

    not important
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2012
  10. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious

    It just was not high on the priority list for anyone with the power to handle it.

    I can only imagine Jan's frustration.

    This is further evidence of the contempt for family existant in the SO that was discussed on other threads.

    Although there were people who cared, it was more of a priority across the boards to ensure that plenty of dough was making it up to INT HQ...

    We know where the money and efforts went.....and how it was used.

  11. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    Holy Shit.

    That makes me swear.

    That means you were there when I was. I was there the whole time it was at the Fountain. And before that at the Melrose. And after that at the ATA - and the CEO, which was over by CC.

    I was wondering why you looked familiar.

    I dont think you were ever directly caring for me though. I would have remembered you quicker I think.

    Do you remember the names of any of the kids that you cared for?

    Seth Price? Robert Klien? Mettayya, Sayadina, Dharma and Chin Dao? Jason Radstrom? Cassavius Tabayoyan?
  12. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    What strikes me is the apparent assumption that the parents who left their children in the 'care' of the 'Church' were negligently failing to visit their children during 'Family Time'.

    Say what? Family Time?

    Someone has an M/U

  13. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    You really wanna get me started about family time?

    It was a scheduled one hour period per day where the parents could see their kids. It was to be around the dinner time.

    My mother rarely came to see us. When she did, she was so tired, all she did was sleep. She did not spend time with me and my brother.

    Finally family time was cancelled and they set up "family day", which was once a YEAR.

    It was regulated and was for all SO members with children. We did not spend time doing whatever we wanted with our family. Everything was done in groups with other families.

    Then that too was cancelled.

    Then the CEO was unmocked.

    Then SO members were not to have children.

    And abortions were totally ok.


    Welcome to an organization that is in POWER on all dynamics.
  14. duddins

    duddins Patron Meritorious




    Ya know Bea....this is the one thing that I just can't get around. Yeh.... there were lots of bad things...and some good.....but WTF! How could this be?

    There should have been lawsuits up the ying yang on cases of child neglect as occurred in PAC.

    I think my brother has an excellent case against the C of S. He was a child for god sake. You were a child. Neglected. In some cases child abuse. Minimally, wreckless endangerment.

    There should be a class action suit for all of the kids that were traumatized by this.

    In this world we live in kid can report me to a teacher or any authority if I smack her/him, and CPS would hear about it and me on my ass like flies to shit.

    So how does C of S get out of years of child neglect and abuse?

  15. TheSneakster

    TheSneakster Guest

    not important
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2012
  16. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    The parents who were negligent was a 'Ser Fac' The parents were not allowed to fulfill their parental duties, even if you weren't clear on that.

    Ron built the system. You worked within it. Are you guilty? Sure. Were the parents? Sure. Was Ron? Absolutely.

    Every attempt to 'justify' or excuse what Scientology has done is itself a crime.

  17. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    Nicole Simms had two sons: Ian Piers and Zeb Sims.

    Nicoles sister had two daughters: Arisia and Thora Magnusson.

    My memory sucks too. But I remember them.
  18. TheSneakster

    TheSneakster Guest

    not important
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2012
  19. TheSneakster

    TheSneakster Guest

    not important
    Last edited by a moderator: Jan 25, 2012
  20. Bea Kiddo

    Bea Kiddo Crusader

    Zeb's a couple years younger than me. So you had the younger ones than me.

    In late 70's I was no longer a toddler.