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You Shouldn't have to Have before you can do.

Discussion in 'General Scientology Discussion' started by Chowderhead, Dec 31, 2007.

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  1. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    Which was first?

    Before I did anything I had parents who provided my birth, upbringing, and education (have). I "had" before I "did".

    Before I became an engineer my parents provided a great deal for my college education. I "had" before I "did".

    I have provided a great deal for my daughter's college education. She is yet "to do" but, in some measure, it will be because she "had" first (this loving gift from me).
  2. The Oracle

    The Oracle Gold Meritorious Patron

    Good point.

    I have some issues with the workers.

    My housekeeper showed up here in the middle of winter three feet of snow in flip flops.

    I couldn't afford a housekeeper but what was I going to do?

    I hired a housekeeper.

    She started out working from 8 a.m. to 5 p.m. at 15.00 an hour. One day a week.

    I paid her the same as everyone else not taking advantage of an illegle immigrant. (El Salvadore).

    I couldn't stand to see her toil away the hours so I told her I would pay her the same amount whether she did the work in three hours or 8.

    She started arriving at 10:00 and leaving at 2:00 with all the work done.

    What are you going to do?

    Now she gets 40.00 and hour and I still clean the toilets before she arrives because I just can't stand the thought of someone else cleaning up after my family toiletwise.

    She's stolen about 2,000.00 worth of jewelry but I know in her situation it is out ethics NOT to steal.

    This may sound wierd, but she loves me. And I obviously love her.

    I respect and admire her for other things beyond housekeeping.

    She is supporting three kids and two parents back in El Salvadore.

    I had business cards made up for her as she was only working for me.

    She started passing them out and now she works six days a week.


    When I was a kid I had a pair of "saddle shoes" that I had to wear during a full winter without socks while I walked three miles to school along the railroad tracks.

    When I got to school they were wet and frozen already and the janitor would meet me by the front door and take them to the broiler room on the broiler so they would dry out and be warm enough for me to take the tracks back home.

    He was good to me.

    I am good to her.

    I know what a difference caring about someone can make in their life .

    I was taught this by the janitor.

    It's this gift of a little care that makes the world go 'round.

    The greatest havingness in the world is watching someone else you know, know you care about them.


    P.S. She's a midget by the way. Very magical. Everything up to five feet of space in my house is clean. She stands on a little stool. The house looks spotless to my kids!
    Last edited: Jan 5, 2008
  3. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    Stealing is unethical, I don't care what her situation was - not if she wants to continue in employment.

    I had an aunt and uncle (now passed away) in Texas who employed legal Mexicans on their ranch. Stealing would get severe consequences. The housekeeper considered it a prevelege to work in the U.S. and was not a thief.
  4. The Oracle

    The Oracle Gold Meritorious Patron

    Severe consequences don't happen in my house.

    For the love of God, most people don't live their whole life and make a critical decision.

    Maybe she stood up to make a critical decision to steal.

    She's bigger than most of us.

    Walk a mile in her shoes.

    Then tell me what I should do.

    What did you say?

    " I don't care what her situation was....."

    This is your handicap.

    I CARE what her situation is .

    I CARE.

    I CARE,

    I CARE,

    Last edited: Jan 5, 2008
  5. The Oracle

    The Oracle Gold Meritorious Patron

    Besides stealing is unethical for YOU at this point in time.

    At another point in time maybe it was ethical.

    If you were in a country and couldn't speak the language and didn't know from day to day if you would be hunted and found because you didn't have papers and you had hungry children, stealing might look like the right thing to do.

  6. Terril park

    Terril park Sponsor

    We have a " Good Samaritan"

    This below condidered by a vast majority of biblical scholars to be
    an actual saying by Jesus. ( ref "The Five Gospels")

    But decide your selves on its worth.

    We even have the concept extended to a " thief". From one who admits to having been a professional thief.

    Such is the power of love, care and compassion, on its
    various flows.

    The parable is found in the Gospel of Luke, chapter 10 verses 25-37.

    On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. "Teacher," he asked, "what must I do to inherit eternal life?" "What is written in the Law?" he replied. "How do you read it?" He answered: " 'Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind'; and, 'Love your neighbor as yourself.'" "You have answered correctly," Jesus replied. "Do this and you will live." But he wanted to justify himself, so he asked Jesus, "And who is my neighbor?"

    In reply Jesus said: "A man was going down from Jerusalem to Jericho, when he fell into the hands of robbers. They stripped him of his clothes, beat him and went away, leaving him half dead. A priest happened to be going down the same road, and when he saw the man, he passed by on the other side. So too, a Levite, when he came to the place and saw him, passed by on the other side. But a Samaritan, as he traveled, came where the man was; and when he saw him, he took pity on him. He went to him and bandaged his wounds, pouring on oil and wine. Then he put the man on his own donkey, took him to an inn and took care of him. The next day he took out two silver coins and gave them to the innkeeper. 'Look after him,' he said, 'and when I return, I will reimburse you for any extra expense you may have.'

    "Which of these three do you think was a neighbor to the man who fell into the hands of robbers?"

    The expert in the law replied, "The one who had mercy on him." Jesus told him, "Go and do likewise."

    [edit] Historical context and modern recasting

    It is important to note that Samaritans were despised by the story's target audience, the Jews. The Samaritans were also largely taught by their interpretation of history to hate Jews.
  7. George Glass

    George Glass Patron

    Thought/Argument negating cliché:

    Example: "You must learn to swim (or you must have), before you can go into the water (do)."

    The premise extending from this is that, because one is unqualified to swim, by virtue of not knowing how, one is therefore unable to enter the water. In the context of a lazy parent (who, themselves, may or may not know how to swim) arguing with their child, any salient points made by the child, on the virtues of entering the water, in order to learn how to swim are rendered, effectively, moot.

    It seems obvious to the child, that the parent is in error or has even lied to the child, however the child - being a somewhat powerless entity - has stumbled across this cliché with several gaping holes and lacks - as children do - the capacity to address them with his authority figure.

    The issue is further obfuscated by the assumption that the parent, being older and wiser in the ways of the world, already knows how to swim and is therefore speaking from experience. The goal of the parent, however, is not to empower the child with knowledge fundamental to swimming, but to thwart the child's incessant pleas to saunter down to the nearest watering hole, where he or she may swing from a rope into the cool water in order to escape the heat of the summer sun.

    The child who is frustrated by his parents inordinate obduracy on the topic of swimming, becomes frustrated with his own attempts to reason with the parent, wresting little satisfaction from continuing the argument. He or she must find another way to remedy their quandary, and to the parent's aims, disengages from the discussion to find some other way to occupy their time.

    That is the essence of the dilemma, so often posed to cult-members, when they encounter an obstacle for which the solution ought to be apparent. Such clichés are meant to bog down the reasoning of an inexperienced debater who, ostensibly, is also under the fog of war, known as mind control. The message sent is one which is perverse. On the surface it says, "You're not trying hard enough and therefore, you do not have." but covertly it says, "Solve the problem, yourself, quietly." or "We want you to stop questioning the status quo." or, "You're clearly on your way out the door so here's a nice steamy cup of shut-the-f*ck-up, so that you'll leave in silence!"
    Last edited: Jan 6, 2008
  8. ExScnDude

    ExScnDude Patron with Honors

    I always have to have a cup of coffee before I do anything.
  9. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

    I aways have to have enough water to swim in!
  10. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    I have to have toilet paper before I can do-do.
  11. Alan

    Alan Gold Meritorious Patron

  12. Leon

    Leon Gold Meritorious Patron

    No you don't.

    In days of old when knights were bold
    And paper was not yet invented,
    You'd wipe your ass on a tuft of grass
    And walk away contented.

    In Africa they traditionally would use a small stone, while the Arabs would use a handfull of sand. Sand works well BTW, I have on occasion used it when out in the bush.
  13. Alanzo

    Alanzo Bardo Tulpa

    Well thank you for that.

    I'll keep it in mind.
  14. ExScnDude

    ExScnDude Patron with Honors

    No wonder the Arabs are pissed off all the time!
  15. The Oracle

    The Oracle Gold Meritorious Patron

    I had sex on the beach once and couldn't walk for a week.

    Who would wipe their butt with that sand?

  16. Leon

    Leon Gold Meritorious Patron

    Ah well you see, I don't have that lovely additional crevice that you have so it was never a problem for me.
  17. programmer_guy

    programmer_guy True Ex-Scientologist

    You're supposed to zipper two sleeping bags together before you do that.

    Jeesh! We need an HCOB issued on this so that this is done correctly in the future.
  18. Zinjifar

    Zinjifar Silver Meritorious Sponsor

    Tch. Whuzzup with the moderns? I thought everybody knew that beach sex *must* be in the female superior (and hands free) position.