Has David Miscavige just lost His "Ethics Presence?"

[25yearsoutfree@last]

The film has seen the light of day exactly two times - DM's celeb handlers are working full time to blame it on enemy line. I'll bet he has a legion of lawyers trying to stop the general release. THAT is when the fit will hit the shan - when everybody can see it for themselves. That will put"R" on the comlines. That will be too hard to ignore, as it will be shown over and over like that energizer bunny with the drum. When it's on rotation and the faithful wonder what all the furor is about, think "what the hell" and they click on the remote and they get sucked in to the Siren call of illicit entheta...

Mimsey

There should be another button..... OMFGY!DCDYH! (Oh my fucking God Yeah! Die Cult Die. Ye Ha!)

 

[25yearsoutfree@last]

.
FBI has let scientology go on with it's crimes and abuse all this time. Won't change now.
"religion" status = get out of jail card whatever you do.

I wonder what would have happened if a politician's wife had been standing in that bucket Debbie Cook stood in....or if Nicole Kidman had been the one standing in it.

DM is losing ethics presence with Hollywood, but NOT with the FBI. They are co-criminals. Business as usual.

I think there should just be a "that makes me sad button"

 

[Sindy]

How many in the Sea Org would even be aware that he did leave?

I don't know. I guess it would depend on whether or not they were on one of his find-me-a-wife, pimp-my-ride or surround-sound-my-mansion crews. :confused2:

 

[Sindy]

Hey, so there are a fair amount of guests on this thread right now. So, if any of you are from inside the organization, why don't you just leave? How much more do you need to endure to feel like you've atoned for all the mistakes you think you've made in life? Come on. People are going to need you to help them later, as this thing continues to collapse and we will help you. You can do it. This is not what you signed up for, is it? Just free yourself.

 

[Chess]

What I don't understand, is why David Miscavige isn't simply making up new levels.

Oh, I think he's a bit too 'gun shy' about doing any more of that.
No easy way to say this, but his squirrel tech has a body count. Look at what his CSing has caused. He nearly came undone big time with Lisa McPherson and there are a number of sick OTs out there with cancer and other maladies, let alone the ones already dead. Suicide and murder have also been aligned to his interference with Bridge processes.
He's one dangerous mf and if he does release any upper OT levels they would be born out of the same mould as his 6 months checks, GATs and other stupidity.
He may be clever and legally street smart but tech intelligent he is not. He's had his fingers burnt meddling with the OT levels and he's not smart enough to come up anything that won't make him a laughing stock.
His decision to get OT8s to start objectives and the Bridge again is about the best he can come up with plus his creation of donation mania. The intelligence level of his followers is not very high, nor is his.

 

[Anonycat]

What I don't understand, is why David Miscavige isn't simply making up new levels.

He doesn't have the unique mental illness, background in Magick and drug-lust that LaFayette had. The smell of rotting teeth may have contributed to LaFayette's charisma, too. There can only be one Sauce.

Only the madman is not a madman if the madman thinks ... wait ... a fella ... no ...

 

[Veda]

Oh, I think he's a bit too 'gun shy' about doing any more of that.
No easy way to say this, but his squirrel tech has a body count. Look at what his CSing has caused. He nearly came undone big time with Lisa McPherson and there are a number of sick OTs out there with cancer and other maladies, let alone the ones already dead. Suicide and murder have also been aligned to his interference with Bridge processes.

He's one dangerous mf and if he does release any upper OT levels they would be born out of the same mould as his 6 months checks, GATs and other stupidity.
He may be clever and legally street smart but tech intelligent he is not. He's had his fingers burnt meddling with the OT levels and he's not smart enough to come up anything that won't make him a laughing stock.

His decision to get OT8s to start objectives and the Bridge again is about the best he can come up with plus his creation of donation mania. The intelligence level of his followers is not very high, nor is his.

The first person to be given the Introspection RD, on the ship, in the early 1970s, after being given auditing that addressed evil purposes and introverted him further, was hailed as a success, with Ron depicted as a hero.

The person was promptly and discreetly off loaded and, shortly thereafter, starved himself to death.

*​

"OTs" were dying of cancer and other maladies long before Miscavige came along.

*​

Quentin Hubbard, Class XII, was driven to suicide by his father, 1976

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS9TYc5nKwU


According to L. Ron Hubbard, sexual perverts, including homosexuals, are made by:

Kicking a baby's head in,
running over him with a steamroller,
cutting him in half with a rusty knife,
boiling him in Lysol,
and all the while with crazy people
screaming the most horrifying
and unprintable things at him.

From 'Dianetics, The Modern Science of Mental Health'


"Hubbard's statement to us was that it's going to take a lot more Ethics and a lot more punishment than anyone can easily face up to, to get this world back in shape." Hana Eltringham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5vMeZBxl4M

When Hubbard's son, Quentin, after having been RPFed twice by his father, committed suicide in 1976, his death was covered up, and Quentin quickly became invisible, having been Scientologically "erased." There was no memorial service for Quentin. Regarded as an embarrassment, he was officially forgotten.

*​

According to Jesse Prince, from 'The ever changing tech of Scientology':

"...this bulletin was effectively cancelled by LRH himself... that's where it all started. All these actions were taken to increase income. It is the same with the six month sec checks...

"But I want to make it clear that the whole idea came from LRH not from Miscavige. Miscavige is continuing to carry out LRH's orders...

"...Miscavige is doing his best to forward Command Intention, which is contained in the huge LRH orders database of the INCOMM computer system of Scientology..."​

http://www.ezlink.com/~perry/CoS/Theology/jesse.htm


Hubbard had told David Mayo to create a level OT 8.

Later, Ray Mithoff was assigned the job.

AFAIK, Hubbard did not tell anyone to create any more OT levels after OT 8. He just left a stack of indecipherable scribble which, he had told Scientologists, in various writings, were the written up OT levels through OT 23.

He lied. They weren't "written up."

It was a mess.

 

[Mimsey Borogrove]

Quote Originally Posted by eldritch cuckoo View Post

What I don't understand, is why David Miscavige isn't simply making up new levels.

When Hubbard was sick on his ass, and thought to be dying, they brought David Mayo, the Sr. C/S up to "over the rainbow" to audit Hubbard and save him. In the course of auditing him, the two "researched' and invented Nots. Look at the Nots HCOBS from that period - they have the initials DM on them. I have read that Hubbard wanted Mayo to create the next OT levels. But, after LRH had come back to life, Mayo was soon declared. He was famously found to be squirreling by "a class 4" whom I think was none other than David Miscavage. Then, when Mayo opened up his Advanced Ability Center they went after him with a vengeance. They trashed his life, paid him off, legally gagged him,and left him to die by the road side

So Miscavage, has about as much chance to recruit Mayo to fulfill Hubbard's wish of writing the next OT levels as a snowball in hell.

Mimsey

 

[Chess]

The first person to be given the Introspection RD, on the ship, in the early 1970s, after being given auditing that addressed evil purposes and introverted him further, was hailed as a success, with Ron depicted as a hero.

The person was promptly and discreetly off loaded and, shortly thereafter, starved himself to death.

*​

"OTs" were dying of cancer and other maladies long before Miscavige came along.

*​

Quentin Hubbard, Class XII, was driven to suicide by his father, 1976

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gS9TYc5nKwU


According to L. Ron Hubbard, sexual perverts, including homosexuals, are made by:

Kicking a baby's head in,
running over him with a steamroller,
cutting him in half with a rusty knife,
boiling him in Lysol,
and all the while with crazy people
screaming the most horrifying
and unprintable things at him.

From 'Dianetics, The Modern Science of Mental Health'


"Hubbard's statement to us was that it's going to take a lot more Ethics and a lot more punishment than anyone can easily face up to, to get this world back in shape." Hana Eltringham

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=v5vMeZBxl4M

When Hubbard's son, Quentin, after having been RPFed twice by his father, committed suicide in 1976, his death was covered up, and Quentin quickly became invisible, having been Scientologically "erased." There was no memorial service for Quentin. Regarded as an embarrassment, he was officially forgotten.

*​

According to Jesse Prince, from 'The ever changing tech of Scientology':

"...this bulletin was effectively cancelled by LRH himself... that's where it all started. All these actions were taken to increase income. It is the same with the six month sec checks...

"But I want to make it clear that the whole idea came from LRH not from Miscavige. Miscavige is continuing to carry out LRH's orders...

"...Miscavige is doing his best to forward Command Intention, which is contained in the huge LRH orders database of the INCOMM computer system of Scientology..."​

http://www.ezlink.com/~perry/CoS/Theology/jesse.htm


Hubbard had told David Mayo to create a level OT 8.

Later, Ray Mithoff was assigned the job.

AFAIK, Hubbard did not tell anyone to create any more OT levels after OT 8. He just left a stack of indecipherable scribble which, he had told Scientologists, in various writings, were the written up OT levels through OT 23.

He lied. They weren't "written up."

It was a mess.

My goodness - well there you go... thanks, can't refute that, the whole timeline of the subject shows it is indeed dangerous.
As far as lives go, alcohol has killed and fucked up countless millions, yet it is still consumed at an alarming rate. My question is I suppose, if someone makes sense of scientology, doesn't rip people off with it nor lie to them about it is it OK to consume it if the consumption is by willing participants? Or should it be made illegal?

 

[degraded being]

.
It's true. I was actually quite hetero sexual, and one day mum was bored, so she said "What can I do today? I know, let's boil you in Lysol and cut you in half with a rusty knife" I was like "don't I get to do anything interesting?!" She said "well I'll see if dad will run you over with a steamroller as well". It was a fun day and I got to be queer as well.

 

[Veda]

When Hubbard was sick on his ass, and thought to be dying, they brought David Mayo, the Sr. C/S up to "over the rainbow" to audit Hubbard and save him. In the course of auditing him, the two "researched' and invented Nots. Look at the Nots HCOBS from that period - they have the initials DM on them. I have read that Hubbard wanted Mayo to create the next OT levels. But, after LRH had come back to life, Mayo was soon declared. He was famously found to be squirreling by "a class 4" whom I think was none other than David Miscavage. Then, when Mayo opened up his Advanced Ability Center they went after him with a vengeance. They trashed his life, paid him off, legally gagged him,and left him to die by the road side

-snip-

Mimsey

All of Hubbard's former auditors and/or research assistants were later attacked/betrayed by Hubbard. It was always the kiss of death to be in that role.

Hubbard liked to give people titles or give people assignments. In the early 1950s, he sent Helen O'Brien a long letter about how she was to invent a machine that could be snuck into mental institutions and used to "exteriorize" mental patients. Helen O'Brien had no idea of how to do such a thing. It was ridiculous, unless one considers that Hubbard was "playing" Helen O'Brien in some fashion - much as he had attempted to "play" the FBI with his strange letters of the same period.

During the mid 1960s, John McMaster, a research assistant, who became "the first real Clear," was made the "Pope" of Scientology. He was soon after made a galley hand (de facto slave) on the "flagship" Apollo, then, in 1969, declared a Suppressive Person.

What happened to David Mayo followed the same or similar pattern as experienced by his predecessors.

As for Miscavige recruiting Mayo to write the next OT levels, Mayo ceased to be a Scientologist decades ago. He wouldn't want the job even if Hubbard returned with bells on and apologized for having him kidnapped and brought to the desert, where, in the summer heat, he was made to run around a pole, while Hubbard C/Sed it from a safe distance.

Miscavige knew there were no more OT levels as far back as the early 1990s. At that time he had a team of highly trained tech people who could have concocted more OT levels, just as Ray Mithoff concocted the current "New OT 8." It would not have been difficult. The same Scientologists who accepted that "Dianetics (routinely) makes Clears," "(Lots) More (problem) BTs after OT 3," "LRH causatively discarded the body as a super OT," "Loyal Officer #1 Pat Broeker erased," and Ray Mithoff's "New OT 8," would have accepted the additional invented OT levels.

Sooner or later, someone, either Miscavige or his successor, will present Scientologists with more OT levels.

Wait and see.

 

[Veda]

My goodness - well there you go... thanks, can't refute that, the whole timeline of the subject shows it is indeed dangerous.
As far as lives go, alcohol has killed and fucked up countless millions, yet it is still consumed at an alarming rate. My question is I suppose, if someone makes sense of scientology, doesn't rip people off with it nor lie to them about it is it OK to consume it if the consumption is by willing participants? Or should it be made illegal?

"If someone makes sense of Scientology" (You mean parts of Scientology?)

"doesn't rip people off with it" (Sounds like they'd be "squirrels.")

"nor lie to them about it" (Sorry, that doesn't sound like Scientology. You're definitely advocating "squirrelling.")

"is it OK to consume it if the consumption is by willing participants?"


Well, from your description, "it" wouldn't be "it" (the total package) any longer, but only bits and pieces of it.

So you're no longer really taking about Scientology.

 

[Commander Birdsong]

What if the FBI determined that they had an overwhelming case where they could prosecute the CoS under the RICO Law.

Would they be able to freeze their assets in that case? (at least in the U.S.)

theoretically yes

likely no

 

[Lulu Belle]

As for Miscavige recruiting Mayo to write the next OT levels, Mayo ceased to be a Scientologist decades ago. He wouldn't want the job even if Hubbard returned with bells on and apologized for having him kidnapped and brought to the desert, where, in the summer heat, he was made to run around a pole, while Hubbard C/Sed it from a safe distance.

I don't know where I've been but this is the first time I have heard that LRH C/Sed Mayo on the Running Program.

Mayo would have been on it - when? - 1982? 1983? He was still Snr. C/S Int when I got into the SO in mid 1982 so it must have been some time after that. LRH was already in his motor home or whatever by then.

Can you tell me more about this?

 

[Lulu Belle]

The problem with being fascinated by scientology is it's REALLY small fry in the world, and there's a tendency to claim any revelation as mind blowing and the thing that will now see the organisation brought to its knees. One only has to read through the comments on Mike R's blog to see how much well-intentioned hope there is from invested people, but also how very much in a bubble of Sci-watching we can be.

I very much agree with this (this post was great, by the way). As an ex-Sea Org member, one of the shocks that many of us go through that got out is how many people know nothing about Scientology and could care less.

See, I don't think the cult ARE quaking in their boots. Some at the top will be worried, especially Dave, but not in any world-ending way. He has the staff, the security, the money and the buildings under him. He is like a dictator or warlord from a repressive state. He and those at the top are going to milk this thing as long as possible, and then go. There will always be a country willing to turn a blind eye in exchange for money, or even for the global notoriety of sheltering someone like that. Look at Russia, a civilised and proud nation, that has consistently courted and protected with its veto some of the most repressive regimes. I'm sure Putin sees it as a lovely two fingers up to the US that he is protecting Edward Snowdon.

I don't know; this I don't agree with.

First of all, this kind of shit always rolls downhill when you are in Scientology, especially if you're on staff. A good example is when there was a judgement against Scientology in the Kristofferson case. Basically all staff and most of the public were shipped up to Portland to do a dog and pony show to get the decision reversed. (It worked, by the way.)

I also don't think Miscavige is really thinking in terms of letting the church go and moving on. I could be wrong, but I just don't see it. It's not just the money that he cares about. It's the power. He'll never have power like he has now if he leaves, regardless of how much money he takes with him. I don't think he plans on going anywhere.

 

[Veda]

I don't know where I've been but this is the first time I have heard that LRH C/Sed Mayo on the Running Program.

Mayo would have been on it - when? - 1982? 1983? He was still Snr. C/S Int when I got into the SO in mid 1982 so it must have been some time after that. LRH was already in his motor home or whatever by then.

Can you tell me more about this?

Several years ago there was an attempt to airbrush Hubbard out of this, and even make him appear to be the good guy, and it became pretty crazy, so, yes, I could go further into it, but I won't, except to post a quote from an affidavit:

"14: On Aug 2, 1982, David Miscavige, and others, acting on orders from L. Ron Hubbard, kidnapped me and subsequently kept me captive, and physically and mentally abused me for six months."

And a link to the affidavit: http://www.holysmoke.org/dm/dmayo005.htm


There was no doubt in David Mayo's mind that Hubbard wanted to psychologically, and perhaps physically, destroy him.

 

[Lulu Belle]

Several years ago there was an attempt to airbrush Hubbard out of this, and even make him appear to be the good guy, and it became pretty crazy, so, yes, I could go further into it, but I won't, except to post a quote from an affidavit:

"14: On Aug 2, 1982, David Miscavige, and others, acting on orders from L. Ron Hubbard, kidnapped me and subsequently kept me captive, and physically and mentally abused me for six months."

And a link to the affidavit: http://www.holysmoke.org/dm/dmayo005.htm


There was no doubt in David Mayo's mind that Hubbard wanted to psychologically, and perhaps physically, destroy him.

Thanks for this, Veda. But I still don't quite get that LRH was C/Sing him. This shows he ordered him to the program, but not really anything else.

Don't mean to split hairs. It's just that I didn't think he was doing any actual hands on tech stuff at that point.

 

[Veda]

Thanks for this, Veda. But I still don't quite get that LRH was C/Sing him. This shows he ordered him to the program, but not really anything else.

Don't mean to split hairs. It's just that I didn't think he was doing any actual hands on tech stuff at that point.

Well, what can I say? I have credible information indicating otherwise. Unfortunately, I can't share all of it with you at this time.

 

[Veda]

As a post script, I'll submit this for contemplation, for those who think that Hubbard was "off lines" at the time.

From ten months ago at Mike Rinder's blog:

"...LRH directed exactly what was to be done at the Mission Holders Conference in SFO following the one in Clearwater. The whole thing was recorded so it could be sent to him. He listened to it, sent Miscavige and the others commendations and ordered that the entire transcript be published..."

http://www.forum.exscn.net/showthre...king-derringer&p=967138&viewfull=1#post967138

The San Francisco Mission Holders conference occurred in mid October, 1982, two and half month after David Mayo was kidnapped.

 

[Lulu Belle]

Well, what can I say? I have credible information indicating otherwise. Unfortunately, I can't share all of it with you at this time.

I don't disbelieve you. I just didn't know this.